#213 - Matt Dalio: Why America's Future Depends on Raising Builders, Not Consumers

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All so we're j we were just talking about
~ the Middle East and Abu Dhabi

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and Dubai and stuff and I was fascinated
by the conversation that that

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we had around the environment and and what
you love about it and you said,

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Hey, we just really can't do that anywhere
else in maybe the country

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or America right now. So I j I'm just
like,

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Let me give Matt the platform for thirty
minutes and just like tell us what

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he loves that's happening around the world
and then maybe we can try

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to like relive or revive some of that in
our country.

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I don't know.

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Yeah, you know, I'm I I I think there's a
huge opportunity for ~ what

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I describe as like reverse innovation,

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like innovation, especially I spent a lot
of time in emerging markets.

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~ as you mentioned, I I I lived in Abu
Dhabi and and ~ and and loved it.

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and when I look at the opportunity like if
it let's take emerging markets

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for a second. When you look at emerging
markets and you see

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the requirements for innovation that take
place.

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In other words, like in a place where
there are no resources,

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you have no choice but

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To optimize for and design things for a
place with no resources.

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And it turns out that that's actually kind
of useful in a place that either

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has resources because there are
innovations that apply,

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or thinks it has resources and doesn't,

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which is largely our education system
here,

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including our healthcare system,

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by the way, as well. ~ And so I I I,

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you know, it's funny, I I spent the
majority of the last 15 years focused

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on emerging markets and how you get tools
to people and how you upskill people

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in those environments.

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and I've come back to America to kind of
like bring what I have learned

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in these places because I've realized that
in some ways America needs it as much as,

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if not more than, a lot of these places.

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And if you don't have a stable America,

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if you don't have a healthy America,

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you won't have a stable and healthy world.

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~ and so, you know, I in many ways I feel
like it's kind of this like return

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the boon, you know, to find the the the
secret sauce outside and and and

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~ you know, even on a personal level,

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by the way, just it's because it's you
funny.

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I'm I moved back literally into my
childhood home.

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~ so my kids are in in my bedroom and I'm
in my parents' bedroom.

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~ and there's the the the book The
Alchemist.

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I'll I'll give away the the spoiler alert
so hit pause ~ if you don't want it.

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But ~ he travels around the world looking
for the treasure and he discovers

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in the end that the treasure is underneath
the tree in his backyard.

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And I was out with my childhood friends
I've known since eight years old,

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~ in my childhood.

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backyard making a tree fort with my kids
with all of our kids running around making

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mud pies and I'm like, America,

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man, I I spent all these years trying to
travel around the world to,

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you know, find the treasure and and here
it is literally under the tree

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in my backyard.

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What do you ~ if we could break it down to
like a small statement or a small idea,

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it's a big idea but something that's easy
to communicate.

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What do you think the treasure of this
country is?

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Builders. and I and I don't know if it's
we we are builders or we were builders

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and or or or right now some people are
builders and a lot of people aren't
builders,

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but like it what did we do? We we built
the future,

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we innovated, well, you know, railroads,

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cannons, you know, ~ medicine.

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I mean, we for so long, where was the
innovation engine of the entire planet?

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It was in this country. And you know,

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you you you

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you talk about different countries.

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I I lived in China for a a a year when I
was eleven years old.

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I I flew to live with a Chinese family.

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My parents were here. I was there.

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I went to an all Chinese school and I
spent about a decade working with orphans

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in in in rural China, ~ living here,

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but back and forth there. And I I look at
what that country has done from when

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I was eleven years old to to now.

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And I remember walking the streets of
China when I was eleven years old.

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And I don't know why this like stuck so
you know

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Deeply in my brain. I remember thinking,

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could could this country, could China ever
be as great as America,

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like a developed country? And I remember
walking ~ back to to my apartment,

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and there was the cracked sidewalk,

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and I was like, they'd have to rebuild
every square meter of this entire country.

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And my conclusion was impossible.

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And you fast forward a couple of decades
and they have

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built every single square meter basically
of that entire country

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and they have learned how to build
everything.

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Like they are on the frontier of what they
build.

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And today I drive from Connecticut into
New York on a regular basis and

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I drive by the FDR drive and so many other
corners of of America and

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I see literally like crumbling concrete
and steel.

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And I I ask myself the same question:

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could we rebuild America to be a great
nation again?

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And the answers we have to

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metaphorically and literally rebuild every
square meter of this country

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and every ultimately the the the reason
that China was able to do that

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was because they rebuilt and rewired the
brains of basically every person

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in that country. And so they took a nation
that used to ban ~ education,

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where where the teachers were like in the
Cultural Revolution,

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put Dunce hats on and ~ and and beaten and
killed.

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Education was was squeezed out of the
entire country

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And then they valued it and they they
imbued it through the entire it just

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I mean in ways that that that you know,

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China every five years produces more
engineers than the entirety of America
has.

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Right. They i i it I mean, there's just so
many statistics you could cite

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on on how ~ much capability they have put
into their into their into their youth

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that then grow up to be the adults that
then go on to create.

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And people think it's the the free labor,

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the cheap labor. It ain't. It it you know,

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the backflips that Chinese robots are
doing is not cheap labor,

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it is cheap engineers that mean that you
can do that.

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You know, Tesla being, you know,

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d demolished basically globally by BYD,

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it's not a coincidence that BYD has
100,000 engineers.

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So when you look at every little corner of
every product they build,

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it's been produced by brilliance.

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And so if America wants to rebuild

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It's greatness, going back to your core
question,

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which is like, what is America's
greatness?

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It's always been that it is a nation of
builders and innovators.

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And if it wants to be that in the future,

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it needs to start with its young people
and make sure that they are democratized,

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that everyone grows up capable of being a
nation of builders and young people,

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not just this little corner and a dot on
Silicon Valley,

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you know, where they're all they make so
much money and they have so much power
that

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people hate them because everyone else.

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doesn't get to keep up with that.

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You know, so y yeah, of course.

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But until we democratize it rather than
demonize it,

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we're gonna be in a place where we don't
have the skills.

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Yeah. I'll I'll s say just one last thing,

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sorry for the long ramble, but no ~ my my
wife is from Argentina,

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so go go go Argentina. When the ~ I'll
date this this this this podcast

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Around the end of those World Cup games.

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Yeah. My wife included.

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And Argentina a hundred years ago there
they used it was so rich.

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There used to be a saying that that rich
like an Argentine was was

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one of the richest nations in the world.

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And now it's a mess in shambles.

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And at the end of the day it comes down to
people.

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It comes down to, you know, did you
prepare your people to build?

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And America can either go back to being
great or it can become the next Argentina.

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And you know, sorry to my wife and her
family,

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but I I hope that America becomes the
America that it's always been.

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Awesome. All right. So we're talking about
young folks in education.

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So let me give you an intro here and we'll
set the table about what Matt's doing

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now and maybe unlock the rest of the
conversation.

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So ~ so today's guest is Matt Dalio,

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founder and CEO of Endless Studios and
Endless,

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where he's helping the next generation
become creators of technology rather than

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simply consumers of it. An entrepreneur
since his teens,

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Matt's founded the China Care Foundation
at just sixteen.

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And he spent his career building
mission-driven organizations at

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the intersection of technology,

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education, and entrepreneurship,

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which makes me smile. While many people
know the Dahlio name,

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Matt has spent his career intentionally
building something entirely his own.

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Today we're talking about leadership,

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legacy, purpose, and what it means to
build organizations that create lasting

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impact. So, Matt, welcome to the Not
Necessary Entrepreneur,

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and I'm glad that we ended it based upon
about building organizations.

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So, ~

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What talking about the young and about
education and and rewiring the mind

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to learn different, because my brain goes
to such a simple place.

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When you talk about you being an eleven
year old and walking on that sidewalk

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and it was broken up and you said,

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could they fix it? They'd have to,

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they'd have to build it from the ground
up,

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tear it down and build it from the ground
up.

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And if you look then over the next 31
years of your life,

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not to date you, but the next 31 years of
your life,

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the transition that you've seen in that
country,

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my brain instantly goes to this place.

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Maybe it's a

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An idealistic place, but I'm like,

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why can't we?

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The the only why can't is because we don't
have the people who can.

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But that you can change, that you can
train.

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So there's there's no reason aside from us
today not having the people

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who can that prevents us from having it.

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We just have to train the people who can.

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So what's that look like? What do we need
to do?

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Because that's where you're at.

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It seems like your brain is there.

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You're comprehending the world and who we
for us to become this idealistic vision

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of maybe in the 70s, eighties,

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and nineties that we believed we were.

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It seems when I wake up and watch the
media every day and all over the world,

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it seems like we don't believe we're that
anymore.

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And and inside my organizations and my
companies and the things I've been
involved

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in building, it all started with an idea
and a dream and a hope.

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And then you accomplished these enormous
things that seemed impossible because

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we all believed.

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So so I I mean I'll I'll tell my story
briefly just 'cause I so I went to
Harvard,

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I went to a ~ Stanford Business School,

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I went to, you know, a a grade high
school.

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I had a great education. ~ the greatest
education that I had was building

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the China Care Foundation. I was sixteen
years old and I I was a kid

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who just wanted to help. I spent a summer
in an orphanage,

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I discovered I could, I came back,

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I was able to raise a little bit of money,

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it was my Eagle Scout project,

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and like next thing you know, I'm

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Placing 50 kids in foster families,

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holy cow, changing their lives and then 50
surgeries.

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And then that became five children's homes
and you know,

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a decade in my life and thousands of kids.

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And the process of learning how to build,

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learning how to find a problem,

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encounter a problem, encounter our
corruption,

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and the orphanage leader that's trying to
make us only work with her

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and go through and I, you know,

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and then the person that I'm with it
storms out and like,

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and I'm 17 years old, like what what the
heck is going on?

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How do I deal? That is all.

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learning. And ~ so I the the process of
building something

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is the best education for knowing how to
build something.

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Process of doing something is,

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you know, in most cases the best education
for knowing how to do it.

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Just do it. And then have mentorship and
guidance and fail and then learn

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and iterate and try to, you know,

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not not cut yourself too many times.

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In a world of software,

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which is let's just be really clear,

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the world we are in,

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In a world of AI, which, whether you like
it or not,

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is the world that we are in, that the
ability to be fluent with what

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it means to create in a world of software,

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what it means to create in a world of AI,

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is kind of table stakes. It kind of is the
core fluency that you need

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in this moment in time. And most people in
our country don't even know what

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it means and looks like at a granular
level,

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let alone

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understand how to teach it. And so like
when you go to the educational system
that's

229
00:11:42,228 --> 00:11:47,965
supposed to teach it, the educational
system is rightfully still focused on

230
00:11:48,225 --> 00:11:50,207
how do I teach English and literature?

231
00:11:50,207 --> 00:11:52,339
How do I teach math? How do I ch teach,

232
00:11:52,339 --> 00:11:56,824
you know, history? And so there's more
time and attention focused on,

233
00:11:56,824 --> 00:12:00,058
I don't know, geology or or geography.

234
00:12:00,446 --> 00:12:05,000
than there is on like the tools that right
now may disrupt the entire workforce

235
00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:07,372
and you know wipe away all of our jobs.

236
00:12:07,372 --> 00:12:09,433
And like it, as they say, the sentence is,

237
00:12:09,433 --> 00:12:11,505
it ain't going to be AI that's replacing
your job.

238
00:12:11,505 --> 00:12:15,378
It's someone who's using AI that will
replace your job and probably replace 10
jobs.

239
00:12:15,378 --> 00:12:19,622
So why aren't we teaching more people to
be the power user of the power tools

240
00:12:19,622 --> 00:12:21,123
so that they're the ones with the jobs?

241
00:12:21,123 --> 00:12:24,876
Because if everyone is 10x times the per
the as productive,

242
00:12:24,876 --> 00:12:26,487
they're all going to have super jobs.

243
00:12:26,487 --> 00:12:29,920
And if you have a tie an entire generation
with that,

244
00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:32,154
They're all gonna know how to solve all
the other problems.

245
00:12:32,154 --> 00:12:37,304
So, you know, as I say, it's like if I
could teach ~ solve one problem,

246
00:12:37,304 --> 00:12:40,300
it is to train the next generation to
solve all the other problems.

247
00:12:41,228 --> 00:12:43,000
What does your brain, what you're building
with endless,

248
00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:44,511
what does your brain tell you you need to
do?

249
00:12:44,511 --> 00:12:47,364
Like what's the objective to train the
next generation?

250
00:12:47,364 --> 00:12:49,086
Like what do you think the tool is,

251
00:12:49,086 --> 00:12:52,029
the objective, ~ maybe the objective
resource,

252
00:12:52,029 --> 00:12:54,181
the action? Is your brain in a single
where you're like,

253
00:12:54,181 --> 00:12:56,513
do this and we will unlock that?

254
00:12:56,513 --> 00:12:57,513
So

255
00:12:57,112 --> 00:13:02,967
So I I have a ~ I I just wrote a a a book
manuscript and and I just put it online.

256
00:13:02,967 --> 00:13:04,888
It's at an endless future.com.

257
00:13:04,888 --> 00:13:07,801
~ and my whole goal is to kind of edit it
in the open.

258
00:13:07,801 --> 00:13:09,472
I'll probably publish it in about a year.

259
00:13:09,472 --> 00:13:11,098
And there are three parts to the book.

260
00:13:11,098 --> 00:13:13,516
There are three acts. The third act is you
know,

261
00:13:13,516 --> 00:13:15,878
here's what we're doing, here's how we're
thinking about the solution space.

262
00:13:15,878 --> 00:13:18,680
But before we get to that, that's like 20%
of the book.

263
00:13:18,680 --> 00:13:19,751
That's a fraction of the book,

264
00:13:19,751 --> 00:13:24,055
if that. ~ the the primary ~ chapter,

265
00:13:24,055 --> 00:13:25,506
the big act is the stakes.

266
00:13:25,730 --> 00:13:30,754
Where we talk about like, why is it so
important to to teach young people

267
00:13:30,834 --> 00:13:34,988
the skills that will drive their
individual future and our societal future?

268
00:13:34,988 --> 00:13:37,149
Like, what does it look like if we fail to
do that?

269
00:13:37,149 --> 00:13:39,201
What does it look like if we succeed at
doing that?

270
00:13:39,201 --> 00:13:42,544
And the, you know, one way of putting it
is the way you just described it,

271
00:13:42,544 --> 00:13:44,315
it's that you know, in 31 years,

272
00:13:44,315 --> 00:13:45,726
we are a nation of builders again.

273
00:13:45,726 --> 00:13:49,740
We are a strong nation. And the other one
is we are Argentina and China

274
00:13:49,740 --> 00:13:52,652
is now America. And like that,

275
00:13:52,652 --> 00:13:54,774
that will come down to, I believe.

276
00:13:55,174 --> 00:13:58,295
one core thing, which is do people have
the ability to have jobs?

277
00:13:58,295 --> 00:13:59,425
Do they have the ability to thrive?

278
00:13:59,425 --> 00:14:00,495
Do they have the ability to build?

279
00:14:00,495 --> 00:14:04,076
And so that's the the vast majority of the
book.

280
00:14:04,076 --> 00:14:07,235
That's the where I spent the vast majority
of the time ~ researching it,

281
00:14:07,235 --> 00:14:10,228
writing it. Then there's the ~ act two,

282
00:14:10,228 --> 00:14:12,149
which is like, okay, well let's look at
the clues.

283
00:14:12,149 --> 00:14:14,469
Let's let's think about like how would you
solve that?

284
00:14:14,469 --> 00:14:16,150
What are the the clues that we can lean
on?

285
00:14:16,150 --> 00:14:18,300
Let's call them first principles that can
kind of,

286
00:14:18,300 --> 00:14:21,991
you know, be our foundation stones or
things that we can pull together,

287
00:14:21,991 --> 00:14:24,512
the the Lego bricks to to then assemble a
solution.

288
00:14:25,460 --> 00:14:29,804
And the biggest there are really two core
pillars that that that that

289
00:14:29,804 --> 00:14:32,016
I think the the solution boils down to.

290
00:14:32,016 --> 00:14:38,822
~ the first is let's just look at how
today's tech entrepreneurs learned

291
00:14:38,882 --> 00:14:40,564
and let's just reverse engineer it from
there.

292
00:14:40,564 --> 00:14:42,986
So like Elon Musk, Mark Zuckerberg,

293
00:14:42,986 --> 00:14:45,298
Demas Asabis, the Nobel Prize winner in
AI,

294
00:14:45,298 --> 00:14:51,694
like how did they all learn? And what I
realized was ~ that most of our engineers
on

295
00:14:52,310 --> 00:14:54,252
A prior product that we were focused on,

296
00:14:54,252 --> 00:14:56,342
an operating system focused on emerging
markets,

297
00:14:56,342 --> 00:14:59,736
which is where my, you know, focus in in
education really began.

298
00:14:59,736 --> 00:15:04,220
Almost all of our engineers learned to
code by hacking their games as kids.

299
00:15:04,220 --> 00:15:07,873
Like when I interviewed engineer after
engineer,

300
00:15:07,873 --> 00:15:10,194
I was just curious, you know, like my tell
me your life story.

301
00:15:10,194 --> 00:15:11,375
It's almost like a podcast, right?

302
00:15:11,375 --> 00:15:12,566
Like that's my interview style.

303
00:15:12,566 --> 00:15:14,448
Tell me your life story. Where'd where'd
you get your start?

304
00:15:14,448 --> 00:15:16,139
And I remember the first time I heard it,

305
00:15:16,139 --> 00:15:17,591
it was this like sheepish person was like,

306
00:15:17,591 --> 00:15:18,591
well, it's kind of embarrassing,

307
00:15:18,571 --> 00:15:20,153
actually, but I loved video games as a
kid.

308
00:15:20,153 --> 00:15:21,864
And then I hacked them.

309
00:15:22,402 --> 00:15:27,083
And that was just so cool. And then I
discovered this in almost every interview.

310
00:15:27,083 --> 00:15:29,574
And so I I left with the question,

311
00:15:29,574 --> 00:15:31,564
well, then why aren't we teaching this
way?

312
00:15:31,564 --> 00:15:35,496
If this is how all of these extraordinary
tech entrepreneurs got started,

313
00:15:35,496 --> 00:15:37,526
why aren't we teaching this way?

314
00:15:37,526 --> 00:15:39,507
The irony is I don't play games.

315
00:15:39,507 --> 00:15:42,297
I don't have time for games. Like at this
day and age,

316
00:15:42,297 --> 00:15:45,268
I'd say I've got young kids, like I've got
other things to do.

317
00:15:45,268 --> 00:15:47,919
So for me, this is not like I love games.

318
00:15:47,919 --> 00:15:49,042
I just, you know, kind of, you know,

319
00:15:49,042 --> 00:15:51,820
used this because I want more people to
play games.

320
00:15:52,140 --> 00:15:54,176
Not at all. I don't even want more people
to play games.

321
00:15:54,176 --> 00:15:55,901
I want more people to build games.

322
00:15:55,901 --> 00:15:57,186
I want more people to

323
00:15:57,374 --> 00:16:01,686
Hacking d Sorry, but did the hacking come
from your cu the curiosity about the game?

324
00:16:02,828 --> 00:16:06,180
It it came from ~ a love of the game,

325
00:16:06,180 --> 00:16:08,892
which which there are three and a half
billion gamers in the world

326
00:16:08,892 --> 00:16:12,495
and and the average gamer plus spends ten
thousand hours playing video games.

327
00:16:12,495 --> 00:16:15,116
Like the i it is kind of like ~ you know,

328
00:16:15,116 --> 00:16:17,198
if there are three billion people under
the age of twenty-five years old,

329
00:16:17,198 --> 00:16:19,910
we need to teach them all to code or or
teach to create,

330
00:16:19,910 --> 00:16:24,583
not code. and and and we need to engage
them for thousands of hours of what

331
00:16:24,583 --> 00:16:26,594
it takes to learn. Games do that.

332
00:16:26,594 --> 00:16:31,758
Games already do that. Now, if you look at
the number one trend in games.

333
00:16:32,256 --> 00:16:34,567
It's UGC, user-generated content,

334
00:16:34,567 --> 00:16:37,790
Minecraft, Fortnite, cre Fortnite
Creative,

335
00:16:37,790 --> 00:16:40,711
Roblox. These are all user-generated
content engines.

336
00:16:40,711 --> 00:16:45,855
Why? For the same reason that my one year
old loves building blocks

337
00:16:45,855 --> 00:16:47,516
and stacking them on top of each other,

338
00:16:47,516 --> 00:16:51,578
and my four and five year olds love
assembling Legos and Magnetiles,

339
00:16:51,578 --> 00:16:55,080
and that I love building companies and
building my kids' tree fort.

340
00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:57,602
We like as humans building things.

341
00:16:58,420 --> 00:17:00,211
And expressing our creativity,

342
00:17:00,211 --> 00:17:03,053
whether that's I'm building a database in
the back end to support

343
00:17:03,053 --> 00:17:07,185
the inventory system, or I'm building the
3D models to build a world,

344
00:17:07,185 --> 00:17:09,967
or I'm the person assembling those things
to build levels,

345
00:17:09,967 --> 00:17:13,179
~ you know, or I'm the designer designing
an interface.

346
00:17:13,179 --> 00:17:17,421
We like creating and we like doing it
collaboratively,

347
00:17:17,421 --> 00:17:19,291
by the way. We like doing things with
friends,

348
00:17:19,291 --> 00:17:22,144
which is why the other greatest trend is
multiplayer games,

349
00:17:22,144 --> 00:17:25,195
right? When you can do things with people
that you like.

350
00:17:26,038 --> 00:17:29,930
And so the act of building a game across
all of the disciplines,

351
00:17:29,930 --> 00:17:32,469
the many, many from sound to narrative to
you know,

352
00:17:32,469 --> 00:17:34,102
all the different you know, marketing,

353
00:17:34,102 --> 00:17:37,463
data analytics, all the disciplines it
takes to build and take to market a game.

354
00:17:37,463 --> 00:17:40,044
And you get to do that with other people,

355
00:17:40,044 --> 00:17:42,045
it's it's like the ultimate game.

356
00:17:42,045 --> 00:17:44,526
Except in the process of doing that,

357
00:17:44,526 --> 00:17:49,369
you are systematically able to teach the
entire entrepreneurial journey from

358
00:17:49,369 --> 00:17:52,480
ideating to designing to building to
deploying.

359
00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,701
to iterating to make sure that you then
get the right product to

360
00:17:55,701 --> 00:17:57,940
hit product market fit to scale.

361
00:17:58,616 --> 00:18:00,427
So in the past, I think I thought about,

362
00:18:00,427 --> 00:18:04,550
you know, back in the days of Carnegie and
JP Morgan and,

363
00:18:04,550 --> 00:18:07,422
you know, we've heard the men who built
America in the early nineteen hundreds

364
00:18:07,422 --> 00:18:09,213
and late eighteen hundreds. We used to
build physical things.

365
00:18:09,213 --> 00:18:14,306
So we we accumulated a lot of humans
around this idea and we trained the

366
00:18:14,306 --> 00:18:17,098
old way and the current way of training
that we're trying to we trained each other

367
00:18:17,098 --> 00:18:18,919
how to build physical things and do
physical things.

368
00:18:18,919 --> 00:18:21,801
This new modern age, what you're on the
forefront of,

369
00:18:21,801 --> 00:18:22,892
we've got to do with tech.

370
00:18:23,970 --> 00:18:27,003
I yeah, I I there's a a complete ~
duality,

371
00:18:27,003 --> 00:18:31,757
like a yes and here. The first is ~ tech
is just a a kid with a computer

372
00:18:31,757 --> 00:18:34,390
can get doing it. You don't you don't need
a 3D printer,

373
00:18:34,390 --> 00:18:37,502
you don't need, you know, massive CNC
equipment,

374
00:18:37,502 --> 00:18:40,685
you don't you know, you just it's a kid
with a with a cheap device.

375
00:18:40,685 --> 00:18:44,869
And then the second is in the modern era
of manufacturing,

376
00:18:44,869 --> 00:18:46,971
like who is innovating? Look at SpaceX,

377
00:18:46,971 --> 00:18:49,984
look at Tesla, look at you know it's
software.

378
00:18:50,434 --> 00:18:51,795
There's yeah, exactly. Nvidia,

379
00:18:51,795 --> 00:18:54,616
they're software companies. At the end of
the day,

380
00:18:54,616 --> 00:18:57,297
they they are tech enabled companies.

381
00:18:57,297 --> 00:18:59,658
It's not a person sitting there welding.

382
00:18:59,658 --> 00:19:02,080
It's a person building a robot that welds.

383
00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:05,961
And so like the more tech enabled you are,

384
00:19:05,961 --> 00:19:08,563
the more capable you are of building.

385
00:19:08,563 --> 00:19:12,725
I I have a a a a chapter that that I'm in
the middle of writing that I'll

386
00:19:12,725 --> 00:19:15,286
add to the manuscript, but it talks about
rebuilding America.

387
00:19:15,618 --> 00:19:17,179
And I mean it literally, physically.

388
00:19:17,179 --> 00:19:19,871
How would you rebuild all of these square
blocks?

389
00:19:19,871 --> 00:19:21,203
How would you build new towers?

390
00:19:21,203 --> 00:19:22,974
How would you build affordable housing?

391
00:19:22,974 --> 00:19:26,087
How would you build again? And at its
core,

392
00:19:26,087 --> 00:19:28,829
all of those innovations, if you look at
how China does it,

393
00:19:28,829 --> 00:19:31,034
again, people still think it's like
someone sitting there,

394
00:19:31,034 --> 00:19:35,316
you know, screwing, you know, with the I
just saw actually today

395
00:19:35,316 --> 00:19:38,957
an Instagram video of a robotic hand that
is sitting there perfectly,

396
00:19:38,957 --> 00:19:41,279
like way faster than any human can do it,

397
00:19:41,279 --> 00:19:43,531
screwing in just like a ro like a human
hand,

398
00:19:43,531 --> 00:19:44,762
except 10x the speed.

399
00:19:45,406 --> 00:19:50,810
~ I like i the innovators in this world
are the people who

400
00:19:50,810 --> 00:19:53,313
are capable of creating that sort of
thing.

401
00:19:53,313 --> 00:19:58,297
And we still think we need to train more
factory workers and make more factory jobs

402
00:19:58,297 --> 00:20:01,900
rather than train more people to be able
to be the ones creating

403
00:20:01,900 --> 00:20:04,402
the machines that are then the factory
workers.

404
00:20:04,402 --> 00:20:09,006
If everyone had those skills, we'd build
many better things and we'd have everyone

405
00:20:09,006 --> 00:20:10,006
employed.

406
00:20:10,798 --> 00:20:12,068
Yeah, I just sat here and imagined,

407
00:20:12,068 --> 00:20:15,509
you know, being building sales
organizations and real estate companies

408
00:20:15,509 --> 00:20:18,410
and that that was the space that I came
from and now it's expanding.

409
00:20:18,410 --> 00:20:23,411
But ~ I think so often about the
abilities,

410
00:20:23,411 --> 00:20:24,862
and I'm like, if everybody could be an
engineer,

411
00:20:24,862 --> 00:20:27,021
at times I make fun of engineers because
I'm like,

412
00:20:27,021 --> 00:20:31,464
just deal with an engineer trying to help
them process a sales transaction,

413
00:20:31,464 --> 00:20:33,284
and it'll take you ten times the length.

414
00:20:33,284 --> 00:20:35,365
We'll get there, it'll be completely
refined.

415
00:20:35,365 --> 00:20:40,426
But I imagine if all the people in my
sales organizations had an engineering
mind.

416
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:42,793
Combined with the sales skills.

417
00:20:42,793 --> 00:20:45,438
Then you're talking about a capability
that's elite.

418
00:20:45,838 --> 00:20:47,298
That's exactly right. That's exactly
right.

419
00:20:47,298 --> 00:20:49,410
It's not that everyone needs to be an
engineer.

420
00:20:49,410 --> 00:20:51,622
It it it's I'll use the example of Excel.

421
00:20:51,622 --> 00:20:55,985
Like it it it you know, back in the day it
was a much more specialized skill

422
00:20:55,985 --> 00:20:56,985
and you learn how to, you know,

423
00:20:56,901 --> 00:20:59,347
operate these, you know, funky things
called spreadsheets.

424
00:20:59,347 --> 00:21:00,968
And now it's just like, I mean,

425
00:21:00,968 --> 00:21:04,250
how do you how do you have a white collar
job without knowing how to use Excel?

426
00:21:04,250 --> 00:21:07,142
Like, you know, the the salesperson needs
to be able to track the funnel,

427
00:21:07,142 --> 00:21:10,434
track the pipeline, understand how to who
they should follow up with.

428
00:21:10,784 --> 00:21:12,825
And the person who was more tech enabled,

429
00:21:12,825 --> 00:21:15,366
like we I was just going through a
pipeline from one one of our

430
00:21:15,366 --> 00:21:17,456
our our team members, not an engineer,

431
00:21:17,456 --> 00:21:21,798
but he was sitting there vibe coding a
custom solution for the pipeline

432
00:21:21,938 --> 00:21:24,294
so that it could pop up automatically for
him.

433
00:21:24,294 --> 00:21:27,310
It basically does with way more
flexibility than Salesforce.

434
00:21:27,310 --> 00:21:29,130
What Salesforce does, and he spent,

435
00:21:29,130 --> 00:21:31,481
I don't know, ~ a a hundred dollars in
tokens,

436
00:21:31,481 --> 00:21:34,462
if that, you know, I think you just use
the default cloud subscription.

437
00:21:34,902 --> 00:21:37,691
And probably only and I bet with that
hundred dollars in tokens and

438
00:21:37,691 --> 00:21:39,456
him coming and going and interacting with
it,

439
00:21:39,456 --> 00:21:42,356
he accomplished it. It didn't even take
him a full day to build the thing.

440
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:46,376
Correct. And and that's the type of person
that you want to hire.

441
00:21:46,376 --> 00:21:48,821
And if that's the type of person that you
want to hire,

442
00:21:48,821 --> 00:21:52,087
then that's as someone who's trying to
train themselves to be hireable,

443
00:21:52,087 --> 00:21:55,774
that's the skill set that you want to have
so that you are the one who was hired.

444
00:21:56,258 --> 00:21:58,380
Yep. We need to develop this. So I let me
go back,

445
00:21:58,380 --> 00:22:01,583
even though I like continuing the
progression on from A to B to C.

446
00:22:01,583 --> 00:22:02,954
We're in chapter two of the book,

447
00:22:02,954 --> 00:22:04,358
but to go back in chapter one real quick,

448
00:22:04,358 --> 00:22:05,358
I didn't want to interrupt you,

449
00:22:05,286 --> 00:22:09,280
but you talked about ability and what my
brain fired off on.

450
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:12,322
Let's talk about this inter s intersection
or difference that's

451
00:22:12,322 --> 00:22:15,595
not intersecting between ability and then
capability.

452
00:22:15,595 --> 00:22:18,188
Because they're different.

453
00:22:19,234 --> 00:22:22,796
Yeah, well, the irony of AI is it takes
people without ability and

454
00:22:22,796 --> 00:22:25,357
it gives them capability. You know,

455
00:22:25,357 --> 00:22:28,339
like this person I just described was
pointing out of that sales funnel,

456
00:22:28,339 --> 00:22:30,610
like he can't code, but he can make,

457
00:22:30,610 --> 00:22:33,421
you know, because he knows how to use this
tool.

458
00:22:33,421 --> 00:22:39,405
And so AI has lowered the floor of
capability

459
00:22:39,665 --> 00:22:41,906
or of ability to be able to have
capability.

460
00:22:42,850 --> 00:22:45,051
Yeah. So what are we trying what do we
need to train more?

461
00:22:45,051 --> 00:22:46,411
Does one come after the other?

462
00:22:46,411 --> 00:22:49,472
Because my brain's been on this for the
past six to twelve months.

463
00:22:49,472 --> 00:22:53,433
It's like, hey, without me being too
complex and trying to simplify processes

464
00:22:53,513 --> 00:22:58,175
of turning people into the skills driven
folks to accomplish the tax task

465
00:22:58,175 --> 00:22:59,976
and live the life they want, what do I
need?

466
00:22:59,976 --> 00:23:01,996
Do I need to be developing ability in
them?

467
00:23:01,996 --> 00:23:06,668
Or do I just need to input and download
software that gives them

468
00:23:06,668 --> 00:23:07,678
the capability to do it?

469
00:23:09,048 --> 00:23:12,790
So what you always want is from when
you're hiring people,

470
00:23:12,790 --> 00:23:17,943
the person who ha has themselves the most
capability,

471
00:23:17,943 --> 00:23:21,355
the most agency. Like set a problem and
then they're just off and running.

472
00:23:21,355 --> 00:23:24,597
And regardless of whether they have the
software or tool that the goes in,

473
00:23:24,597 --> 00:23:26,048
right, they they just solve the problem.

474
00:23:26,048 --> 00:23:32,972
And nothing gets in the way. where we
focus is is in younger people,

475
00:23:32,972 --> 00:23:36,514
right? Kind of, you know, let let's call
it 13 to 25 years old.

476
00:23:37,262 --> 00:23:38,502
And I and I will say that, you know,

477
00:23:38,502 --> 00:23:40,734
at that age, the way that people learn is
really,

478
00:23:40,734 --> 00:23:42,115
really different. When you're young,

479
00:23:42,115 --> 00:23:44,436
the way you learn is really different than
when you're older.

480
00:23:44,436 --> 00:23:46,217
So I'll use the example of like a
language.

481
00:23:46,217 --> 00:23:47,347
If you're learning a language,

482
00:23:47,347 --> 00:23:49,108
like I'm if I'm gonna learn French,

483
00:23:49,108 --> 00:23:50,609
I want someone to sit there and be like,

484
00:23:50,609 --> 00:23:52,790
here is the translation, here is the
grammar,

485
00:23:52,790 --> 00:23:54,331
here are the rules of conjugation.

486
00:23:54,331 --> 00:23:57,453
Now I go to my five year old, I want him
to learn French.

487
00:23:57,453 --> 00:24:00,175
Like, I'm not gonna sit down and tell him
what conjugation is.

488
00:24:00,175 --> 00:24:03,096
I'm gonna just let him play with you know
some kids who speak French

489
00:24:03,096 --> 00:24:05,157
and he's gonna be speaking French in like
no time.

490
00:24:05,157 --> 00:24:06,258
And

491
00:24:06,686 --> 00:24:11,860
Young people learn by doing and making and
creating and immersing,

492
00:24:11,860 --> 00:24:13,472
right? Language immersion, or whether,

493
00:24:13,472 --> 00:24:17,435
you know, my my 16-year-old self immersing
myself in building,

494
00:24:17,435 --> 00:24:20,478
I learned way more than I would have ever
at that age taking

495
00:24:20,478 --> 00:24:27,013
an entrepreneurship class. And so ~ the
way we look at this question

496
00:24:27,013 --> 00:24:30,086
is there's this kind of ~ people that talk
about the chicken and egg problem

497
00:24:30,086 --> 00:24:32,988
of like they have to learn the
foundational skills to be able to do the
thing,

498
00:24:32,988 --> 00:24:34,470
and then you can enable them with AI.

499
00:24:35,404 --> 00:24:37,355
I think it's almost really kind of the
reverse.

500
00:24:37,355 --> 00:24:41,138
I think in re in reality it built goes in
both directions and it's like ratcheting

501
00:24:41,178 --> 00:24:43,300
up. But I'll make the case for the
reverse,

502
00:24:43,300 --> 00:24:47,723
which is if you throw a kid who doesn't
know how to let's use the word code,

503
00:24:47,723 --> 00:24:52,927
right? Syntax, sit down with a keyboard
and and actually type code into code,

504
00:24:52,927 --> 00:24:56,069
and they have to read a textbook this
thick and they have to sit there

505
00:24:56,069 --> 00:24:57,980
and like understand what loops are,

506
00:24:57,980 --> 00:24:59,842
and you know, like good luck, right?

507
00:24:59,842 --> 00:25:02,964
That's the reason like 99% of young people
today can't code.

508
00:25:03,904 --> 00:25:07,256
If you're like, well, here's a tool and
you can just kind of talk to

509
00:25:07,256 --> 00:25:08,947
it and it'll unlock what you want.

510
00:25:08,947 --> 00:25:12,229
And then yeah, you can see the code and
you can talk to about what's going on.

511
00:25:12,229 --> 00:25:15,331
And there's this module that you're trying
to build that you don't understand,

512
00:25:15,331 --> 00:25:17,682
but you can then ask it what's going on.

513
00:25:17,682 --> 00:25:21,184
So now all of a sudden you start to
understand the code without actually
having

514
00:25:21,184 --> 00:25:25,287
to type it. Now all of a sudden that makes
that person a little bit more fluent.

515
00:25:25,287 --> 00:25:28,869
It's like my five-year-old suddenly
speaking a language and then coming over

516
00:25:28,869 --> 00:25:30,820
and asking me a question what does this
mean,

517
00:25:30,820 --> 00:25:31,820
dad?

518
00:25:31,628 --> 00:25:34,759
You know, when a and now all of a sudden
that curiosity comes.

519
00:25:34,759 --> 00:25:37,880
And so now all of a sudden that person
might be willing to watch

520
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:40,491
the five minute video on YouTube that
explains what,

521
00:25:40,491 --> 00:25:42,581
you know, what the for loop is,

522
00:25:42,581 --> 00:25:48,303
or you know. And so when you when you
spark interest

523
00:25:48,883 --> 00:25:52,224
and you immerse, you suddenly have the
ability to learn.

524
00:25:52,224 --> 00:25:56,886
And ~ you know, I think adults are that
way as well,

525
00:25:56,886 --> 00:25:58,346
but I know kids are that way.

526
00:25:59,052 --> 00:26:02,435
I also know that the way that adults tend
to teach is the way that adults want

527
00:26:02,435 --> 00:26:03,937
to learn. In other words, like,

528
00:26:03,937 --> 00:26:05,789
you know, when you go to the language
class,

529
00:26:05,789 --> 00:26:09,022
they teach the the five-year-old a lot
more like they would teach

530
00:26:09,022 --> 00:26:11,454
a 55-year-old than they that than just,

531
00:26:11,454 --> 00:26:15,277
you know, let's go play kids. ~ and so

532
00:26:15,990 --> 00:26:19,221
So it sounds like we just need it's almost
the curiosity is important,

533
00:26:19,221 --> 00:26:22,012
right? But it there and there the
willingness seems to come.

534
00:26:22,012 --> 00:26:24,762
Maybe you you as a kid, maybe a 13 year
old,

535
00:26:24,762 --> 00:26:27,635
what I found, there's different levels of
work ethic and different levels

536
00:26:27,635 --> 00:26:29,396
of commitment, the people you've been
influenced by,

537
00:26:29,396 --> 00:26:31,917
what you've been taught, maybe the cohorts
and the friends that

538
00:26:31,917 --> 00:26:33,737
you spend time around. It's like a kid,

539
00:26:33,737 --> 00:26:36,578
we show up with a certain level of
willingness already.

540
00:26:36,578 --> 00:26:40,800
But the other sixty or seventy or eighty
percent that we know it's in there,

541
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,301
we just have to have to get them more
willing.

542
00:26:43,301 --> 00:26:44,942
So I think what you touched on is

543
00:26:45,122 --> 00:26:47,487
You just have to get them participating
and using a little bit.

544
00:26:47,487 --> 00:26:52,226
And if if you if you do, then the brain
wants to learn and grow and be

545
00:26:52,226 --> 00:26:53,226
a part of something more.

546
00:26:53,646 --> 00:26:56,048
Totally. You you make them you you get
them using it,

547
00:26:56,048 --> 00:26:59,510
you get them tinkering, and then you get
them in an environment that they're
excited

548
00:26:59,510 --> 00:27:03,272
about. So you know, I there are a couple
of examples that come to mind,

549
00:27:03,272 --> 00:27:08,146
but you know, w ~ one example is the kid
in in in inner city Bronx

550
00:27:08,146 --> 00:27:10,807
who went through one of our programs and
and afterwards the teacher

551
00:27:10,807 --> 00:27:11,872
he like he wouldn't stop talking,

552
00:27:11,872 --> 00:27:13,339
he was just so excited. He was just like,

553
00:27:13,339 --> 00:27:14,339
Let me tell you all these things.

554
00:27:14,210 --> 00:27:16,291
And afterwards the teachers pulled me
aside and they said,

555
00:27:16,291 --> 00:27:17,882
Matt, you don't realize that kid

556
00:27:18,112 --> 00:27:19,964
Is the hardest kid in the entire school.

557
00:27:19,964 --> 00:27:22,506
Every day from eight o'clock until four
o'clock in the afternoon,

558
00:27:22,506 --> 00:27:24,788
he feels like he's failing everything in
life.

559
00:27:24,788 --> 00:27:27,030
And this is the first time we've seen him
engaged.

560
00:27:27,030 --> 00:27:31,202
And so when you see someone who ~ you
know,

561
00:27:31,202 --> 00:27:33,335
we tend to take that kind of person and
say,

562
00:27:33,335 --> 00:27:34,656
I'm sorry, we can't help them,

563
00:27:34,656 --> 00:27:35,927
or let's go put them in, you know,

564
00:27:35,927 --> 00:27:39,570
the remedial class, or let's categorize
them rather than we just needed

565
00:27:39,570 --> 00:27:42,963
to engage them. You know, and the other
example that comes to mind is

566
00:27:42,963 --> 00:27:44,985
a friend of mine who who I grew up with
is,

567
00:27:44,985 --> 00:27:46,296
you my my my entire life.

568
00:27:46,944 --> 00:27:48,034
and he dropped out of high school.

569
00:27:48,034 --> 00:27:50,335
~ and he loved playing video games.

570
00:27:50,335 --> 00:27:56,317
And when he was doing it, he ended up ~
joining this is back when like Epic

571
00:27:56,317 --> 00:27:59,507
the the had had Unreal and the Unreal
licenses like a million dollars.

572
00:27:59,507 --> 00:28:01,998
There was some competition to get a free
Unreal license.

573
00:28:01,998 --> 00:28:04,989
And so he joined 12 other people that he
met online.

574
00:28:04,989 --> 00:28:07,670
He started building this game and he won
the competition and won

575
00:28:07,670 --> 00:28:11,000
the million dollar license. And that got
him a job at Rockstar.

576
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,521
And now he's a tech entrepreneur because
that was that was his journey.

577
00:28:14,521 --> 00:28:16,422
And so

578
00:28:16,822 --> 00:28:20,191
It like passion goes a long way.

579
00:28:21,282 --> 00:28:27,478
Absolutely. ~ what do you think that
what's a lesson throughout your journey

580
00:28:27,478 --> 00:28:29,940
of life and that we can take this into
what you're really doing with endless?

581
00:28:29,940 --> 00:28:31,046
Because I want to take, you know,

582
00:28:31,046 --> 00:28:32,462
we talk about the stuff up in the clouds,

583
00:28:32,462 --> 00:28:33,993
and it's like practically, what are you
doing?

584
00:28:33,993 --> 00:28:35,915
Like, what's your vision to really build
this?

585
00:28:35,915 --> 00:28:38,046
How's it going to stack? But if you go
back,

586
00:28:38,046 --> 00:28:40,939
what's one lesson that you learned on your
own?

587
00:28:40,939 --> 00:28:43,871
That'll that 11-year-old. See,

588
00:28:43,871 --> 00:28:46,444
there's something that was going on in
your head when you're walking down that
swat

589
00:28:46,444 --> 00:28:49,216
sidewalk in China that occurred to you at
11 years old.

590
00:28:49,784 --> 00:28:53,798
You're like, what if? But what's there a
lesson throughout this process

591
00:28:53,798 --> 00:28:58,112
of the education you've had through the
nonprofit you built in China that

592
00:28:58,112 --> 00:28:59,604
you really had to learn on your own?

593
00:28:59,604 --> 00:29:02,216
The world didn't teach you, parents didn't
teach you,

594
00:29:02,216 --> 00:29:05,949
the educa what is it that you learned on
your own that's really significant today?

595
00:29:07,756 --> 00:29:11,086
I I'd say it's passion. ~ you know,

596
00:29:11,086 --> 00:29:13,128
when I was 11, I was just a normal kid,

597
00:29:13,128 --> 00:29:15,469
thrown into a weird circumstance for sure,

598
00:29:15,469 --> 00:29:17,350
but I was a normal kid. When I was
sixteen,

599
00:29:17,350 --> 00:29:19,071
you know, the blunt, you know,

600
00:29:19,071 --> 00:29:21,091
reality is I wanted to get into college.

601
00:29:21,091 --> 00:29:22,852
My parents wanted me to get into college.

602
00:29:22,852 --> 00:29:24,653
And so it's like, great, go back to China,

603
00:29:24,653 --> 00:29:26,184
volunteer for a summer. And then,

604
00:29:26,184 --> 00:29:27,646
you know, and then I started to,

605
00:29:27,646 --> 00:29:31,066
you know, to do a little bit more and and
it became my Eagle Scout project.

606
00:29:31,066 --> 00:29:37,108
And, you know, but I became me through the
process of doing that.

607
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:40,852
I discovered my passions through the
process of doing that.

608
00:29:40,852 --> 00:29:44,934
And I'll say the dual passions of
realizing that I as a young person could
make

609
00:29:44,934 --> 00:29:47,536
a difference. And like, why would I do
anything else if I could make a
difference?

610
00:29:47,536 --> 00:29:51,198
And and and I mean the circumstance that I
could make a difference.

611
00:29:51,198 --> 00:29:53,319
And then the second is I love building
things.

612
00:29:53,319 --> 00:29:56,191
It like it just was fun to like imagine we
I,

613
00:29:56,191 --> 00:29:58,492
you know, I don't know, I had an idea for
college clubs.

614
00:29:58,492 --> 00:30:01,627
I started a Harvard China Care club with a
friend and then a friend of mine,

615
00:30:01,627 --> 00:30:05,466
you know, actually who I just messaged two
minutes ten minutes before this.

616
00:30:06,130 --> 00:30:08,521
started Brown China Care. And then next
thing you know,

617
00:30:08,521 --> 00:30:10,341
we had at the last club conference,

618
00:30:10,341 --> 00:30:12,952
we merged the the foundation into another
organization,

619
00:30:12,952 --> 00:30:15,753
but the last one was 80 club members at
that club conference.

620
00:30:15,753 --> 00:30:17,753
And it's like I could imagine and then it
happens.

621
00:30:17,753 --> 00:30:19,714
It was just, you know, what a delight.

622
00:30:19,714 --> 00:30:22,214
You know, it's it goes back to the love of
creation.

623
00:30:22,214 --> 00:30:25,195
And all of that was something that I
learned.

624
00:30:25,195 --> 00:30:28,676
I I remember that one of the other vivid
memories I had as being a high schooler

625
00:30:28,676 --> 00:30:31,157
was me being like, but I don't have a
passion.

626
00:30:31,157 --> 00:30:33,437
I don't have a passion. I felt numb.

627
00:30:33,437 --> 00:30:35,458
And today it's like

628
00:30:36,216 --> 00:30:38,919
God, I got a passion. I I got you I I I
care too much.

629
00:30:38,919 --> 00:30:40,411
I sacrifice everything for it.

630
00:30:40,411 --> 00:30:45,827
~ and and that came because of an
experience that I had,

631
00:30:45,827 --> 00:30:47,759
a life experience, all that whole journey.

632
00:30:47,759 --> 00:30:51,023
~ Yeah.

633
00:30:51,023 --> 00:30:52,343
Again, it goes back to that same thing.

634
00:30:52,343 --> 00:30:53,886
Passion gets you a very, very long way.

635
00:30:54,710 --> 00:30:56,912
What so what's the passion? I mean,

636
00:30:56,912 --> 00:30:59,034
with endless, but at at forty two,

637
00:30:59,034 --> 00:31:02,387
where's the passion? It seems like it's
probably linearly focused,

638
00:31:02,387 --> 00:31:05,339
even though I bet you have a lot of
peripheral things going on,

639
00:31:05,339 --> 00:31:06,871
a lot of things taking time and thing,

640
00:31:06,871 --> 00:31:08,362
but but is there a linear focus here?

641
00:31:09,016 --> 00:31:11,607
So everything we do, it's funny you use
the word linear,

642
00:31:11,607 --> 00:31:15,609
but i everything we do maps to this kind
of line that I draw of an S curve,

643
00:31:15,609 --> 00:31:18,231
the skill curve from from novice to
professional.

644
00:31:18,231 --> 00:31:23,353
And ~ I I describe that there are kind of
five main phases in that,

645
00:31:23,353 --> 00:31:25,073
from I I'm just kind of playing,

646
00:31:25,073 --> 00:31:28,626
and then I discover playing and making are
similar to like I'm taking courses

647
00:31:28,626 --> 00:31:30,317
and I'm much more deliberately learning,

648
00:31:30,317 --> 00:31:32,218
to I'm in a community and I'm building.

649
00:31:32,504 --> 00:31:33,755
To now I'm a leader, you know,

650
00:31:33,755 --> 00:31:36,296
in phase four along that that journey I'm
and I'm building,

651
00:31:36,296 --> 00:31:38,837
and other people are part of my mini
community,

652
00:31:38,837 --> 00:31:43,169
to phase five, which is we're actually
building that with professional studios
where

653
00:31:43,169 --> 00:31:45,277
students can go and build with
professional,

654
00:31:45,277 --> 00:31:48,122
you know, prof ~ actually contribute to
real professional games,

655
00:31:48,122 --> 00:31:52,244
the way open source is built. So that's
the the the kind of five-phase journey
along

656
00:31:52,244 --> 00:31:55,635
that line. Everything we do, which is a
lot,

657
00:31:55,635 --> 00:31:56,876
too much. ~

658
00:31:57,478 --> 00:32:01,704
is is basically kind of like this almost
paper mache on top of it.

659
00:32:01,704 --> 00:32:04,598
In other words, here's a piece of
newspaper that I could attach the glue

660
00:32:04,598 --> 00:32:09,935
to and put on the line to make this very
smooth experience where anyone anywhere

661
00:32:09,935 --> 00:32:14,381
can come in with any kind of device they
have and have an experience that brings

662
00:32:14,381 --> 00:32:15,381
them along that curve.

663
00:32:16,789 --> 00:32:18,591
Hm. It sounds so simple.

664
00:32:19,626 --> 00:32:23,568
it's hard. It's not. I I I tried in in act
three,

665
00:32:23,568 --> 00:32:26,179
I tried to make act three in the book as
short as I possibly could because

666
00:32:26,179 --> 00:32:27,299
I didn't really want it to be,

667
00:32:27,299 --> 00:32:28,430
you know, about what we're doing.

668
00:32:28,430 --> 00:32:30,451
I wanted it to be about the case for why
we're doing it.

669
00:32:30,451 --> 00:32:35,853
But it it it's I don't know, eight or ten
chapters of just like here are

670
00:32:35,853 --> 00:32:38,104
all of the concrete things that are going
into it.

671
00:32:38,104 --> 00:32:41,195
You know, we have a couple of
organizations we work with.

672
00:32:41,195 --> 00:32:44,197
~ a company, a nonprofit. We work with
many,

673
00:32:44,197 --> 00:32:45,737
many partners, we invest in things,

674
00:32:45,737 --> 00:32:47,238
we donate to things, we're in this weird

675
00:32:47,608 --> 00:32:50,586
kind of, you know, the ability to to to to
do those.

676
00:32:50,586 --> 00:32:52,161
But everything we do is about,

677
00:32:52,161 --> 00:32:55,722
you know, basically creating that line
from a novice to a professional.

678
00:32:56,588 --> 00:32:59,129
Hmm. All right, so the big idea,

679
00:32:59,129 --> 00:33:00,700
so many people ask me this often,

680
00:33:00,700 --> 00:33:02,481
and ~ and I'll pose it to you.

681
00:33:02,481 --> 00:33:05,093
They don't ask it in this way.

682
00:33:05,093 --> 00:33:08,545
I wish they did, because I'd have a
succinct answer every time that they
would,

683
00:33:08,545 --> 00:33:11,786
it would hit hard. They're asking,

684
00:33:11,786 --> 00:33:13,067
well, what would you do if you're me?

685
00:33:13,067 --> 00:33:16,369
They don't say it quite that way anymore.

686
00:33:16,369 --> 00:33:17,590
But what I would say is, well,

687
00:33:17,590 --> 00:33:20,111
if I'm you sitting in that exact seat
today,

688
00:33:20,111 --> 00:33:22,953
listening to me, whatever you led you
here,

689
00:33:22,953 --> 00:33:25,174
I would tell you everything that I've
learned.

690
00:33:25,642 --> 00:33:27,886
over twenty two years in these businesses
I've been in,

691
00:33:27,886 --> 00:33:31,917
and I would hope to just give you one or
two takeaways that you could have

692
00:33:31,917 --> 00:33:36,241
a semblance of the success overnight and
start building something

693
00:33:36,241 --> 00:33:37,744
and impact the world greater than I have.

694
00:33:37,744 --> 00:33:38,926
And so

695
00:33:40,962 --> 00:33:43,323
So I look at that from from two angles.

696
00:33:43,323 --> 00:33:45,193
One is kind of the core of what we do,

697
00:33:45,193 --> 00:33:46,894
which is, you know, you've got a kid,

698
00:33:46,894 --> 00:33:48,564
do you want to teach them your you know,

699
00:33:48,564 --> 00:33:50,975
a a a a school district, ~ a country,

700
00:33:50,975 --> 00:33:55,756
we, you know, and and that is ~ a parent,

701
00:33:55,756 --> 00:33:57,467
again, take you know, thinking about their
kid,

702
00:33:57,467 --> 00:34:02,845
that this the the skills of Silicon Valley
are different than the skills

703
00:34:02,845 --> 00:34:06,365
of typical school. Teach the skills of
typical school.

704
00:34:06,365 --> 00:34:08,080
I'm not saying those are not important,

705
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:09,780
they are fundamental, foundational.

706
00:34:10,409 --> 00:34:13,931
also teach the skills that make Silicon
Valley Silicon Valley.

707
00:34:13,931 --> 00:34:17,414
~ and I would say, you know, as an adult,

708
00:34:17,414 --> 00:34:19,574
and then also yourselves learn it.

709
00:34:19,574 --> 00:34:21,795
Like absorb it, try it, practice it,

710
00:34:21,795 --> 00:34:25,737
make the time for it, do it. The the
second is,

711
00:34:25,737 --> 00:34:28,730
you know, more I think to to the audience
of the podcast,

712
00:34:28,730 --> 00:34:30,601
which is, you know, what's the
entrepreneurial journey?

713
00:34:30,601 --> 00:34:32,621
And I'll go back to that same word,

714
00:34:32,621 --> 00:34:36,563
which is, you know, find something that
you love.

715
00:34:36,563 --> 00:34:38,495
~ either you're

716
00:34:38,846 --> 00:34:40,746
early in the journey and you're thinking
about it,

717
00:34:40,746 --> 00:34:43,027
you better love it because it's it's not
like it's,

718
00:34:43,027 --> 00:34:45,069
you know, two times harder than you think
it will be.

719
00:34:45,069 --> 00:34:48,630
It's like a hundred times harder than you
think about you know it will be.

720
00:34:48,630 --> 00:34:52,252
Like I I am, my God, I did not expect this
to be this hard.

721
00:34:52,252 --> 00:34:57,914
and then you know and and if you are
already in the journey,

722
00:34:57,914 --> 00:35:00,976
I'll say that there are many, you know,

723
00:35:00,976 --> 00:35:05,708
many ways of of structuring and
restructuring what you are doing.

724
00:35:06,092 --> 00:35:07,824
So that it's something that you can love
doing.

725
00:35:07,824 --> 00:35:10,826
Because the moment that you stop loving
doing it,

726
00:35:10,826 --> 00:35:13,739
like it's not your burn rate that is going
to kill you.

727
00:35:13,739 --> 00:35:16,671
It is your your burn rate of your energy
that is going to kill you.

728
00:35:16,671 --> 00:35:20,184
So, you know, I I Endless has kind of two
chapters.

729
00:35:20,184 --> 00:35:23,839
You know, chapter one, which is ~ actually
I'm currently writing the

730
00:35:23,839 --> 00:35:25,449
pr the the prequel to it about,

731
00:35:25,449 --> 00:35:26,980
which is about the operating system,

732
00:35:26,980 --> 00:35:30,033
the the how you get access to technology
to kids in emerging markets.

733
00:35:30,033 --> 00:35:31,184
That's where we all started with.

734
00:35:31,184 --> 00:35:33,726
~ and that one I I I

735
00:35:34,542 --> 00:35:36,252
You know, on entrepreneurial journey
number one,

736
00:35:36,252 --> 00:35:37,882
I learned a lot. I made a lot of mistakes.

737
00:35:37,882 --> 00:35:41,354
You know, and one of which was I just
totally burnt myself out because

738
00:35:41,354 --> 00:35:43,094
I thought my energy was infinite.

739
00:35:43,094 --> 00:35:46,055
I thought there's no chance I will ever
burn myself out because God,

740
00:35:46,055 --> 00:35:50,146
I had passion. ~ and in you know journey
number two,

741
00:35:50,146 --> 00:35:55,248
I am so diligent. It it's not like let me
go hang out and relax,

742
00:35:55,248 --> 00:36:01,669
so diligent about the ac the actions that
it takes to be able to to to burn

743
00:36:01,749 --> 00:36:03,690
on a marathon type timeline.

744
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:08,283
You know, whether that is the sauna and
cold plunge I do or the meditation

745
00:36:08,283 --> 00:36:10,175
or the journaling I do religiously,

746
00:36:10,175 --> 00:36:12,943
or literally the religion of like I go to
church to listen to the,

747
00:36:12,943 --> 00:36:16,220
you know, sermons, like the the like these
actions,

748
00:36:16,220 --> 00:36:18,302
you know, being present for my family.

749
00:36:18,302 --> 00:36:20,614
My family's been one of the greatest
blessings because they're like

750
00:36:20,614 --> 00:36:23,426
the counterbalance of like they I got no
choice but to be present for them when

751
00:36:23,426 --> 00:36:24,808
I when they when they're when they're
there.

752
00:36:24,808 --> 00:36:26,609
And God, do they make me dil, you know,

753
00:36:26,609 --> 00:36:32,044
d delighted. And so like those things all
allow the candle to burn more slowly.

754
00:36:32,792 --> 00:36:35,124
But we live in an era where the culture is
like,

755
00:36:35,124 --> 00:36:38,236
let the bonfire burn, make it burn with
all the brightness.

756
00:36:38,236 --> 00:36:40,648
And there are times when that is
necessary.

757
00:36:40,648 --> 00:36:44,651
Let's be very clear. But there's also
something so powerful.

758
00:36:44,651 --> 00:36:47,853
I was just speaking to you know a a VC
about this yesterday.

759
00:36:47,853 --> 00:36:49,815
Kind of we're not raising. We don't want
to raise.

760
00:36:49,815 --> 00:36:52,937
I we've got ourselves profitable and I
want to keep it that way and

761
00:36:52,937 --> 00:36:55,809
not change a thing. But I was asking
advice on like how many things

762
00:36:55,809 --> 00:36:59,182
is too many things and and how patient can
I and should I be.

763
00:36:59,894 --> 00:37:05,461
And and like the blessing of being able to
just watch the garden grow is like,

764
00:37:05,461 --> 00:37:08,365
wow, what what a what a blessing.

765
00:37:08,365 --> 00:37:11,949
And so I will say that has been my
experience of it,

766
00:37:11,949 --> 00:37:13,371
right? Everyone has their different
experience,

767
00:37:13,371 --> 00:37:16,203
but it's just a really different
counter-cultural,

768
00:37:16,203 --> 00:37:19,048
counter-trend version of what
entrepreneurship looks like.

769
00:37:19,822 --> 00:37:21,152
So we talked about time. Everybody's,

770
00:37:21,152 --> 00:37:22,304
it's the most valuable thing we have.

771
00:37:22,304 --> 00:37:24,776
You look back on life and it goes decades
go by like that.

772
00:37:24,776 --> 00:37:28,028
But what do you think something that
founders in this entrepreneurial space,

773
00:37:28,028 --> 00:37:30,251
and you were just on the phone with
somebody in the VC space,

774
00:37:30,251 --> 00:37:33,173
probably a a higher level person that
probably wanted to give you some money

775
00:37:33,393 --> 00:37:34,554
and you have to fight them off.

776
00:37:34,554 --> 00:37:40,209
But what's something that you felt that
you've learned now that you and

777
00:37:40,209 --> 00:37:43,682
us that we should spend less time worrying
about throughout these journeys?

778
00:37:46,179 --> 00:37:47,179
~

779
00:37:53,838 --> 00:37:57,300
Growth versus cash. Right.

780
00:37:57,300 --> 00:38:00,322
Like I I it there are so many different
kinds of businesses,

781
00:38:00,322 --> 00:38:05,815
right? So so but at least the venture
business is all about growth.

782
00:38:05,815 --> 00:38:11,898
It it is all about the hundred X ~ company
in the portfolio being offset,

783
00:38:11,898 --> 00:38:14,890
you know, or being the offsetting company
for all the losses.

784
00:38:14,890 --> 00:38:19,312
The entrepreneur has a different
optimization function,

785
00:38:19,312 --> 00:38:22,774
which is a, this is my baby and I'm gonna
make it work.

786
00:38:23,806 --> 00:38:26,448
~ and B, depending on the person.

787
00:38:26,448 --> 00:38:27,748
Some people want to just, you know,

788
00:38:27,748 --> 00:38:31,190
do it, spike it, exit. Other people want
to make it their life.

789
00:38:31,190 --> 00:38:33,391
And I was just listening to a podcast and
it was describing,

790
00:38:33,391 --> 00:38:35,452
like, you know, if if this is your thing,

791
00:38:35,452 --> 00:38:39,985
like you don't get many opportunities to
have an outsized success.

792
00:38:39,985 --> 00:38:42,036
Like, why would you want to give that up?

793
00:38:42,036 --> 00:38:43,397
Why would you want to exit that?

794
00:38:43,397 --> 00:38:49,160
~ and so just cash flow makes such

795
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:52,322
a such a huge difference.

796
00:38:53,102 --> 00:38:56,382
~ which is so different than the the the
typical venture,

797
00:38:56,382 --> 00:38:58,258
let me raise more money so I can lose more
money.

798
00:38:59,298 --> 00:39:01,169
Hmm. Yeah, there's debate on cash flow.

799
00:39:01,169 --> 00:39:02,579
Every time I hear somebody bring that up,

800
00:39:02,579 --> 00:39:04,891
~ I want to counter them and say,

801
00:39:04,891 --> 00:39:06,711
Why is cash flow so important?

802
00:39:06,711 --> 00:39:09,550
Because there's nothing passionate about
cash flow.

803
00:39:09,550 --> 00:39:12,514
I mean, it's it's almost like blood
running through our veins and arteries.

804
00:39:12,514 --> 00:39:16,866
You need it to keep living, but there's
nothing passionate about cash flow.

805
00:39:18,272 --> 00:39:21,865
I I spent the past ~ four years.

806
00:39:21,865 --> 00:39:23,436
I I I've been living in the UAE.

807
00:39:23,436 --> 00:39:25,348
We've had wonderful partnerships there.

808
00:39:25,348 --> 00:39:31,243
and spent the four past four years chasing
contracts that would allow

809
00:39:31,243 --> 00:39:35,556
us to to to build the core underlying tech
to scale,

810
00:39:35,556 --> 00:39:37,848
to deliver the value proposition,

811
00:39:37,848 --> 00:39:41,181
to be on the ground, iterating it and
making sure that we were building

812
00:39:41,181 --> 00:39:43,733
the right thing, grinding through some
very,

813
00:39:43,733 --> 00:39:47,456
very hard journeys of of ensuring.

814
00:39:48,834 --> 00:39:52,536
the survivability, cash flow. And so,

815
00:39:52,536 --> 00:39:54,207
you know, I it was not my passion.

816
00:39:54,207 --> 00:39:59,100
Right. It was I I'm going to do this
because I'm passionate about what I'm
doing.

817
00:39:59,100 --> 00:40:04,783
And so it is four years later that we
finally now get to go and do the thing
that

818
00:40:04,783 --> 00:40:06,263
I set out to do in the first place,

819
00:40:06,263 --> 00:40:08,124
which is to say, come one, come all,

820
00:40:08,124 --> 00:40:09,965
let's open up. Let's get everyone in this.

821
00:40:11,128 --> 00:40:16,091
But we're in a totally different position
today because I spent the past four years.

822
00:40:16,091 --> 00:40:19,514
Four years is a long time in startup land
grinding.

823
00:40:19,514 --> 00:40:22,026
It is a long time to grind and endure
pain.

824
00:40:22,026 --> 00:40:26,469
But doing it so that we could be in the
position that we are now in,

825
00:40:26,469 --> 00:40:28,320
where we have the tools, we have the
methodology,

826
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:29,751
we have the team, we have the curriculum,

827
00:40:29,751 --> 00:40:33,684
we have all the things that we need in
order to be able to start saying,

828
00:40:33,684 --> 00:40:37,476
okay, now come one, come all. And so good.

829
00:40:37,476 --> 00:40:39,668
So yeah, it it's just a

830
00:40:39,842 --> 00:40:43,974
Totally different way of looking at it
than I'm gonna chase a venture vanity
metrics

831
00:40:43,974 --> 00:40:44,974
company.

832
00:40:44,918 --> 00:40:47,660
Yeah. You mentioned operating system
earlier.

833
00:40:47,660 --> 00:40:53,163
I I processed that originally when people
would talk about operating systems

834
00:40:53,223 --> 00:40:55,244
on these PCs that I grew up working on.

835
00:40:55,244 --> 00:40:59,667
Right. So I was fortunate enough to hear
this is gonna be boring,

836
00:40:59,667 --> 00:41:01,759
so I'll get past it quick for the younger
generations,

837
00:41:01,759 --> 00:41:05,991
but the AOL, the dial up, that was the
first sound,

838
00:41:05,991 --> 00:41:09,073
right, on like a Windows ninety-five
computer.

839
00:41:09,073 --> 00:41:10,104
And

840
00:41:10,284 --> 00:41:11,884
An operating system, that's what I've,

841
00:41:11,884 --> 00:41:14,055
and then it gets upgraded, and there's a
new Windows version,

842
00:41:14,055 --> 00:41:18,966
and now you have iOS. So it was the
operating systems that technology,

843
00:41:18,966 --> 00:41:20,977
the brain of technology and how they
worked.

844
00:41:20,977 --> 00:41:25,548
But what I've been talking about over the
past few years is what's

845
00:41:25,548 --> 00:41:26,979
our operating system as humans?

846
00:41:26,979 --> 00:41:29,979
Every individual,

847
00:41:29,979 --> 00:41:33,780
when they ask me a question, what I know
is they're going to ask me a question,

848
00:41:33,780 --> 00:41:38,012
and most likely all of us, we aren't
actually answering a question with

849
00:41:38,012 --> 00:41:39,282
the same dictionary in our hands.

850
00:41:40,814 --> 00:41:42,266
So we almost need to understand,

851
00:41:42,266 --> 00:41:44,358
hey, what operating system are you running
on?

852
00:41:44,358 --> 00:41:48,523
So I know how to engage and answer the
question to help you elevate to the next
one.

853
00:41:48,523 --> 00:41:54,490
So what's the what's the mat operating
system right now in 2026?

854
00:41:56,568 --> 00:42:01,309
So everything I'll I'll I'll use a literal
version just because he

855
00:42:01,309 --> 00:42:04,210
we started there and and I I I I'll get
past it quickly because

856
00:42:04,450 --> 00:42:06,061
it I'll probably bore people, but I love
it.

857
00:42:06,061 --> 00:42:10,592
~ Linux used to be this like crappy
operating system.

858
00:42:10,592 --> 00:42:11,950
I remember going to the basement of my,

859
00:42:11,950 --> 00:42:14,503
you know, college computer science la,

860
00:42:14,503 --> 00:42:17,194
you know, and and and seeing this like Red
Hat Linux and being like,

861
00:42:17,194 --> 00:42:18,874
I'll I'll use this computer over here.

862
00:42:18,874 --> 00:42:20,295
And that computer at the time was Windows,

863
00:42:20,295 --> 00:42:21,765
because that's what everyone used back
then.

864
00:42:21,765 --> 00:42:25,366
~ and and Linux has come a long way since
then.

865
00:42:27,051 --> 00:42:29,812
and Linux is also this flexible toolkit.

866
00:42:29,812 --> 00:42:32,694
It's whatever you want. The metaphor I use
is like a jet engine.

867
00:42:32,694 --> 00:42:35,837
And, you know, usually it had like this
crazy cockpit with all these little knobs

868
00:42:35,837 --> 00:42:39,279
and dials, but like you can just as easily
just put a joystick on that jet engine.

869
00:42:39,279 --> 00:42:42,941
And so what we had to do is we had to
build an operating system

870
00:42:42,941 --> 00:42:44,943
for people who'd literally never used a
computer before.

871
00:42:44,943 --> 00:42:48,425
So we had no choice but to make it
literally the simplest operating system,

872
00:42:48,425 --> 00:42:49,846
desktop operating system in the world.

873
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:52,532
And it turns out it was it actually isn't
that hard.

874
00:42:52,532 --> 00:42:53,582
Just make it like a smartphone.

875
00:42:53,582 --> 00:42:55,023
Everyone knows how to use a smartphone
already.

876
00:42:55,023 --> 00:42:56,624
Put your all your icons on your desktop.

877
00:42:56,624 --> 00:42:59,717
And there the reality is that we had to
touch every layer of the stack

878
00:42:59,717 --> 00:43:01,124
all the way down to like, I mean,

879
00:43:01,124 --> 00:43:05,431
the deepest layers kernel. ~ and in order
to really do that,

880
00:43:05,431 --> 00:43:07,262
the way the update update systems work,

881
00:43:07,262 --> 00:43:08,683
the way the applications were installed,

882
00:43:08,683 --> 00:43:11,825
I won't bore people, but like we had to
change all of that.

883
00:43:11,825 --> 00:43:15,738
And then the changes we made, we actually
pushed into the core upstream Linux

884
00:43:15,738 --> 00:43:18,630
desktop so that now when you download the
big the most popular

885
00:43:18,860 --> 00:43:21,891
Linux desktop in the world, it is full of
top to bottom the changes that

886
00:43:21,891 --> 00:43:24,252
we literally advocated for and made.

887
00:43:24,252 --> 00:43:28,064
and so anyway, real operating system.

888
00:43:28,064 --> 00:43:31,415
The operating system that you run matters
to back to your point.

889
00:43:31,415 --> 00:43:33,376
Like you run Chrome OS, it's a web
browser,

890
00:43:33,376 --> 00:43:36,117
you can't actually do any real things on
it other than what's in the web.

891
00:43:36,117 --> 00:43:41,214
But like real power software, like a real
game engine requires access to the GPU.

892
00:43:41,214 --> 00:43:42,520
You can't do that in a Chrome OS.

893
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:44,941
So anyway, I just say that because the
literal,

894
00:43:44,941 --> 00:43:47,302
you know, the operating system you use
matters.

895
00:43:48,314 --> 00:43:50,525
~ case is is a is a is a huge one.

896
00:43:50,525 --> 00:43:53,816
~ but in terms of, you know,

897
00:43:53,816 --> 00:43:56,305
my operating system, like what powers me,

898
00:43:56,305 --> 00:44:02,238
~ the the metaphor that I'll I'll use is
is Maslow's hierarchy of of needs.

899
00:44:02,238 --> 00:44:04,299
~ we all know Maslow's hierarchy of needs,

900
00:44:04,299 --> 00:44:07,180
kind of the the the base, and then from
there you can get to the level up.

901
00:44:07,180 --> 00:44:10,671
~ so if you have oxygen, then you can work
about worry about water,

902
00:44:10,671 --> 00:44:11,671
then you can worry about food,

903
00:44:11,561 --> 00:44:13,482
and you can worry about one day
self-actualization.

904
00:44:14,764 --> 00:44:17,766
I have a digital Maslow's hierarchy of
educational needs,

905
00:44:17,766 --> 00:44:21,580
which is you need electricity to be able
to have a device,

906
00:44:21,580 --> 00:44:25,052
and in our case, the ~ to go really up the
stack,

907
00:44:25,052 --> 00:44:28,175
you need a computer, because that is this
the tool of the knowledge economy,

908
00:44:28,175 --> 00:44:30,967
~ to be able to have elect internet,

909
00:44:30,967 --> 00:44:32,989
to be able to then have the skills,

910
00:44:32,989 --> 00:44:37,433
to be able to have the job, to then be
able to be self actualized.

911
00:44:37,433 --> 00:44:41,116
And not everyone in the world has all of
those things.

912
00:44:41,116 --> 00:44:43,808
In fact, five billion people on the planet
don't have a computer.

913
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:46,151
In this country, when COVID happened,

914
00:44:46,151 --> 00:44:50,082
we discovered 30 to 40 percent of America
didn't have either a computer

915
00:44:50,082 --> 00:44:53,994
or internet connectivity. There are 800
million people without electricity.

916
00:44:53,994 --> 00:45:00,077
Everything that we do is basically how do
we solve that entire stack?

917
00:45:00,077 --> 00:45:04,308
We are right now focused really on the
skills and income piece,

918
00:45:04,308 --> 00:45:07,880
because that's the utmost important and
most universal and in a world of AI,

919
00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:10,201
most urgent place in the stack.

920
00:45:10,201 --> 00:45:12,972
But we have not forgotten or given up on.

921
00:45:13,304 --> 00:45:14,624
The lower levels of that stack,

922
00:45:14,624 --> 00:45:15,925
which is if you don't have internet,

923
00:45:15,925 --> 00:45:16,995
good luck, if you don't have computer,

924
00:45:16,995 --> 00:45:18,555
good luck, if you don't have electricity,

925
00:45:18,555 --> 00:45:21,026
good luck. And so we've partnered,

926
00:45:21,026 --> 00:45:25,437
we've built, we've, you know, we've done
all sorts of ~ things to keep that alive,

927
00:45:25,437 --> 00:45:29,779
almost in kind of let's call it a
hibernation mode is a little bit too
extreme,

928
00:45:29,779 --> 00:45:34,590
but kind of slow burn mode, while we crack
the skills piece.

929
00:45:34,590 --> 00:45:37,481
Because if we can really crack the skills
piece and have the sorts

930
00:45:37,481 --> 00:45:40,712
of nationwide rollouts that we are already
piloting,

931
00:45:40,712 --> 00:45:42,222
literally with countries to do.

932
00:45:42,700 --> 00:45:46,272
And then have more of those, and all of a
sudden that creates the demand

933
00:45:46,452 --> 00:45:48,073
for the things lower down the stack.

934
00:45:48,073 --> 00:45:50,214
But my operating system at every,

935
00:45:50,214 --> 00:45:55,077
you know, every day I wake up is basically
how do I solve with my time something

936
00:45:55,077 --> 00:45:58,769
up and down that stack with most of it
being in the skill piece.

937
00:45:58,769 --> 00:46:01,375
And most of that skill piece is literally
just that S curve of like,

938
00:46:01,375 --> 00:46:03,611
you know, anyone anywhere can go,

939
00:46:03,611 --> 00:46:04,872
you know, one step further.

940
00:46:05,964 --> 00:46:08,966
So entrepreneurs in all the communities
around this country that listen

941
00:46:08,966 --> 00:46:11,278
to this and they're tuning in to say,

942
00:46:11,278 --> 00:46:13,000
hey, let me listen to this Matt guy.

943
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:14,381
What's he what's he got to say?

944
00:46:14,381 --> 00:46:18,794
What's he building? So recently I was
there's we're here in I'm in Cincinnati,

945
00:46:18,794 --> 00:46:20,696
Ohio, northern Kentucky, southeastern
Indiana.

946
00:46:20,696 --> 00:46:23,328
It's it's about two 2.1 million MSA,

947
00:46:23,328 --> 00:46:26,561
33rd largest in the country. There's a lot
of people that fit into those around this

948
00:46:26,561 --> 00:46:29,713
country, and there's a lot of
entrepreneurs in each one of those
locations.

949
00:46:29,713 --> 00:46:33,036
And there was something that a group of
entrepreneurs and business leaders

950
00:46:33,036 --> 00:46:34,797
a few years ago identified in education,

951
00:46:34,797 --> 00:46:35,797
is that

952
00:46:36,226 --> 00:46:37,687
They weren't kindergarten ready.

953
00:46:37,687 --> 00:46:42,110
There were a bunch of these kids that
weren't even kindergarten ready.

954
00:46:42,110 --> 00:46:43,510
So then that became the focus.

955
00:46:43,510 --> 00:46:46,652
So for someone who cares about the future,

956
00:46:46,652 --> 00:46:48,954
who cares about previous next generations,

957
00:46:48,954 --> 00:46:53,346
who cares about where does the average
entrepreneur that has access to some
funds,

958
00:46:53,346 --> 00:46:56,228
who's built some wealth, where do we go?

959
00:46:56,228 --> 00:46:59,080
Where do we start? Because you said 13 to
25 year olds.

960
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:02,522
In your brain, for a guy like me,

961
00:47:03,040 --> 00:47:05,504
And the thousands of other people like me
that are going to hear this,

962
00:47:05,504 --> 00:47:07,136
that are entrepreneurs that are building
something,

963
00:47:07,136 --> 00:47:10,041
where can we go to make the biggest
impact?

964
00:47:10,041 --> 00:47:11,041
What can we do?

965
00:47:11,928 --> 00:47:13,109
So it's actually great question.

966
00:47:13,109 --> 00:47:14,800
You're realizing I need another chapter of
my book.

967
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:17,593
another section on the website,

968
00:47:17,593 --> 00:47:18,734
which is, you know, who do we support?

969
00:47:18,734 --> 00:47:21,266
Because there there are a lot of people
doing really cool things and and

970
00:47:21,266 --> 00:47:25,309
we we we have a foundation and support a a
lot of people really concretely.

971
00:47:25,309 --> 00:47:27,991
So there they're I I'll take the yeah in
answer to your question,

972
00:47:27,991 --> 00:47:31,144
both age wise, where do we focus and then
also what organizations?

973
00:47:31,144 --> 00:47:34,647
I'll say the coolest company foundation I
found out there is called Hack Club.

974
00:47:34,647 --> 00:47:35,788
It's just doing extraordinary,

975
00:47:35,788 --> 00:47:40,522
extraordinary stuff. They they as an
organization teach and engage more young
people

976
00:47:40,542 --> 00:47:41,542
than.

977
00:47:41,254 --> 00:47:45,355
all American states in computer science
except for four of them.

978
00:47:45,355 --> 00:47:48,036
And by next year it will be literally all
states.

979
00:47:48,036 --> 00:47:50,677
And the year after that they expect it'll
be twice as big.

980
00:47:50,677 --> 00:47:54,538
~ so anyway, that it's such a such a cool
organization.

981
00:47:54,538 --> 00:47:56,679
~ but there are there are a bunch of them.

982
00:47:56,679 --> 00:47:58,690
From an age perspective, you know,

983
00:47:58,690 --> 00:48:02,291
we we focus on the whole S curve because
it's really it's about skill,

984
00:48:02,291 --> 00:48:05,012
not age. ~ but obviously the two
correlate.

985
00:48:05,484 --> 00:48:07,706
When when you get closer to the workforce,

986
00:48:07,706 --> 00:48:11,028
that's when it really matters because
you're launching someone into like a job.

987
00:48:11,028 --> 00:48:13,089
And if they don't have the skills to be
ready for a job,

988
00:48:13,089 --> 00:48:16,157
like do like what college is supposed to
be doing and you know,

989
00:48:16,157 --> 00:48:19,143
very expensive and you know, not
necessarily doing it,

990
00:48:19,143 --> 00:48:22,946
like that it we think that that's the most
important air age.

991
00:48:22,946 --> 00:48:25,538
But I'll also say at the other end of the
spectrum,

992
00:48:25,538 --> 00:48:27,329
we don't do anything with 10, 11,

993
00:48:27,329 --> 00:48:31,422
12 year olds. But if you look at the like
the the the greatest entrepreneurs,

994
00:48:31,422 --> 00:48:32,563
the greater you'll get Bill Gates,

995
00:48:32,563 --> 00:48:34,494
he learned to code when he was 11 years
old and

996
00:48:34,574 --> 00:48:36,275
12 years old. You look at Elon Musk,

997
00:48:36,275 --> 00:48:39,496
same thing. ~ you know, my dad learned to
trade the markets at 12 years old,

998
00:48:39,496 --> 00:48:41,016
and that's what he did for his whole life.

999
00:48:41,016 --> 00:48:44,667
you know, he was talking to Carlos Slim
and he has accounting little notebooks
from

1000
00:48:44,667 --> 00:48:45,738
when he was 12 years old. And so,

1001
00:48:45,738 --> 00:48:48,428
you I lived in China for a year when I was
11 years old.

1002
00:48:48,428 --> 00:48:49,799
It shaped who I am and what I'm doing.

1003
00:48:49,799 --> 00:48:53,437
What you do pre-pubescence versus po,

1004
00:48:53,437 --> 00:48:55,721
you know, in your older years really,

1005
00:48:55,721 --> 00:48:57,971
really makes a difference because you form
identity.

1006
00:48:57,971 --> 00:48:59,512
It's like fluency of language.

1007
00:48:59,810 --> 00:49:03,142
Henry Kissinger learned ~ came to the US
at 13 years old.

1008
00:49:03,142 --> 00:49:04,742
His younger brother was two years younger,

1009
00:49:04,742 --> 00:49:07,784
came at 11 years old. His younger brother
had no accent.

1010
00:49:07,784 --> 00:49:11,596
Henry Kissinger had a very strong accent
for his entire life for all

1011
00:49:11,596 --> 00:49:12,997
you know 90 years that followed.

1012
00:49:12,997 --> 00:49:16,578
So, you know, both of those are important,

1013
00:49:16,578 --> 00:49:20,440
which is why we we have structured our
organizational capabilities to

1014
00:49:20,440 --> 00:49:22,942
be able to kind of span. We haven't fully
gone that young yet,

1015
00:49:22,942 --> 00:49:23,942
but someday we will.

1016
00:49:24,630 --> 00:49:26,791
Yeah. It's cause I think there's a lot of
people.

1017
00:49:26,791 --> 00:49:30,954
I look around and I talk to We're so busy
on our daily objectives

1018
00:49:30,974 --> 00:49:34,807
and running our companies and and jobs
that we're in and inside your own
families.

1019
00:49:34,807 --> 00:49:37,889
It seems like there's not enough time and
so often we recognize there's these

1020
00:49:37,889 --> 00:49:41,401
problems that seem like, Man, why aren't
we fixing these?

1021
00:49:41,401 --> 00:49:42,962
And it's like, where do I go to get
involved?

1022
00:49:42,962 --> 00:49:46,045
And it seems so complex. You just give
money to something and say,

1023
00:49:46,045 --> 00:49:49,017
Well, I guess I did my part. But it seems
like to me,

1024
00:49:49,017 --> 00:49:52,439
the most impactful people in the
communities and in organizations were

1025
00:49:52,439 --> 00:49:53,920
the ones that were like boots on the
ground.

1026
00:49:54,370 --> 00:49:57,841
face to face, handshake to handshake that
were actually that were engaging with

1027
00:49:57,841 --> 00:49:58,841
people.

1028
00:49:58,764 --> 00:50:00,975
Yeah. What what we're currently,

1029
00:50:00,975 --> 00:50:04,317
you know, kind of the way I I look at ~
our way of solving that is

1030
00:50:04,737 --> 00:50:08,209
we are currently in the process of taking
what we have done in kind

1031
00:50:08,209 --> 00:50:11,751
of these deeper dive deployments with with
these various partners and making

1032
00:50:11,751 --> 00:50:13,993
it kind of a kit and a bundle and an
online,

1033
00:50:13,993 --> 00:50:17,394
let's call it SaaS platform with the
different tools and it kind of

1034
00:50:17,425 --> 00:50:20,536
all the pieces that are necessary for
anyone anywhere,

1035
00:50:20,536 --> 00:50:23,828
right? Like you you go to Kentucky and
someone there in Kentucky,

1036
00:50:23,828 --> 00:50:25,719
whether it's a school, a school district,

1037
00:50:25,719 --> 00:50:27,150
a teacher, a nonprofit.

1038
00:50:27,478 --> 00:50:30,860
are able to just take it and and run with
it so that the answer in

1039
00:50:30,860 --> 00:50:34,002
the future to your question for the person
who is in Kentucky,

1040
00:50:34,002 --> 00:50:35,632
an entrepreneur, you know, who's got
who's,

1041
00:50:35,632 --> 00:50:37,243
you know, wants to help their community,

1042
00:50:37,243 --> 00:50:40,125
can literally just go to a us the the
teacher of the school,

1043
00:50:40,125 --> 00:50:41,826
the nonprofit, and say, let's do this,

1044
00:50:41,826 --> 00:50:44,407
let's roll it out. So that's our answer to
it.

1045
00:50:44,407 --> 00:50:47,789
~ but you know, I I will say that,

1046
00:50:47,789 --> 00:50:51,061
you know, I t today I was just walking put
pushing my my my kid around while

1047
00:50:51,061 --> 00:50:53,712
I was on a phone call, my one year old and
and I saw some litter.

1048
00:50:53,712 --> 00:50:56,884
~ and it I I picked up the litter.

1049
00:50:57,630 --> 00:51:01,561
And I I think culturally or or or
literally,

1050
00:51:01,561 --> 00:51:07,393
~ when we live in a world where most
people throw litter on the ground,

1051
00:51:07,393 --> 00:51:08,933
we end up with a littered world.

1052
00:51:08,933 --> 00:51:12,074
And when we end up with a culture where
people say,

1053
00:51:12,074 --> 00:51:16,435
I'll pick up that one piece of litter or
those four pieces of litter,

1054
00:51:16,435 --> 00:51:20,426
we end up with a clean world. And I think
that we live in a society,

1055
00:51:20,426 --> 00:51:23,447
we used to live in a society that was
about,

1056
00:51:23,447 --> 00:51:24,808
you know, we're gonna build a great
nation,

1057
00:51:24,808 --> 00:51:25,878
we're gonna build a great cult,

1058
00:51:25,878 --> 00:51:26,878
you know, ~

1059
00:51:26,840 --> 00:51:27,840
Country, we're going to build a,

1060
00:51:27,830 --> 00:51:30,031
you know, I I I contribute to my society.

1061
00:51:30,031 --> 00:51:31,732
And everyone did their small part.

1062
00:51:31,732 --> 00:51:34,063
And today I think we live for many,

1063
00:51:34,063 --> 00:51:38,964
many reasons ~ in a culture that is a lot
more,

1064
00:51:38,964 --> 00:51:42,496
I'll use the word greedy, but a lot more
about how can I,

1065
00:51:42,496 --> 00:51:44,336
you know, focus on what I need.

1066
00:51:44,336 --> 00:51:48,418
And it they're not at odds. You can do
what you need.

1067
00:51:49,128 --> 00:51:52,460
it didn't take me ~ you know, more than a
second to pick up each of those pieces

1068
00:51:52,460 --> 00:51:55,661
of litter. And I still got to have my
phone call and I still got to push my
child,

1069
00:51:55,661 --> 00:51:57,542
I still got to do it all, you know,

1070
00:51:57,542 --> 00:52:00,054
and I still got to get my brain going so
that I could have a,

1071
00:52:00,054 --> 00:52:03,165
you know, an energized, clear headed
conversation for this.

1072
00:52:03,165 --> 00:52:05,962
~ but I I would say that it, you know,

1073
00:52:05,962 --> 00:52:10,529
really doesn't take that much for each
person in their own little community

1074
00:52:10,529 --> 00:52:12,350
to do their part for their own little
community.

1075
00:52:13,194 --> 00:52:16,916
Mm. Do you think it's important that we
find purpose so that we're inspired

1076
00:52:16,916 --> 00:52:17,916
to do it?

1077
00:52:18,700 --> 00:52:24,563
I I I think the there's this chicken and
egg problem of like you don't care unless

1078
00:52:24,563 --> 00:52:28,444
you're close to something and and until
you're close to the people that you're

1079
00:52:28,444 --> 00:52:30,515
~ that are are affected by it.

1080
00:52:30,515 --> 00:52:35,477
~ and so you don't take the step until you
see them.

1081
00:52:35,477 --> 00:52:38,509
But if you step into it and you get a
little bit closer,

1082
00:52:38,509 --> 00:52:39,599
all of a sudden you really care.

1083
00:52:39,599 --> 00:52:46,262
And like for me, you know, I I I it I went
to an orphanage as a sixteen year old.

1084
00:52:46,710 --> 00:52:49,531
not really caring much because I just
didn't know much.

1085
00:52:49,531 --> 00:52:54,624
And then I held a dying child and realized
I could do something about

1086
00:52:54,624 --> 00:52:56,574
it and literally save that child's life.

1087
00:52:56,574 --> 00:53:01,397
Or like met a little girl who was a
six-year-old girl who had this giant hairy

1088
00:53:01,397 --> 00:53:03,268
navus, this kind of black hair across her
skin,

1089
00:53:03,268 --> 00:53:05,639
but was this of course her face was this
wow,

1090
00:53:05,639 --> 00:53:08,820
vibrant little girl, and discovered that
there was I asked about her,

1091
00:53:08,820 --> 00:53:11,241
discovered there was a family that didn't
have the money to they would adopt

1092
00:53:11,241 --> 00:53:12,241
it or they got they were ready.

1093
00:53:12,092 --> 00:53:13,092
They were ready to they just

1094
00:53:13,336 --> 00:53:16,948
couldn't fly because they couldn't afford
the cost of the ticket to pick her up.

1095
00:53:16,948 --> 00:53:18,890
And we provided the financial aid.

1096
00:53:18,890 --> 00:53:21,532
And that girl to this day is my
goddaughter.

1097
00:53:21,532 --> 00:53:25,224
And like I remember when she came home and
she was she was,

1098
00:53:25,224 --> 00:53:27,786
you know, watching Lelo and Stitch was her
favorite movie,

1099
00:53:27,786 --> 00:53:30,798
which by coincidence is about adoption and
never giving up on family

1100
00:53:30,798 --> 00:53:32,219
and like when you're family, you're
family.

1101
00:53:32,219 --> 00:53:37,693
And today, like my kids have a little ~
this Tony Box thing with this little

1102
00:53:37,693 --> 00:53:40,925
character that they put on and it tells
the story of Lelo and Stitch.

1103
00:53:40,925 --> 00:53:42,136
And it's like,

1104
00:53:42,326 --> 00:53:45,888
You know, the i it the the the the I don't
know,

1105
00:53:45,888 --> 00:53:49,890
the circ the the cyclicality of it is i is
beautiful and yet

1106
00:53:49,890 --> 00:53:53,772
it wouldn't have happened if I hadn't
gotten on that plane and met that little
girl.

1107
00:53:53,772 --> 00:53:59,145
And so ~ who who I ~ is actually probably
gonna be coming out here in

1108
00:53:59,145 --> 00:54:00,896
a couple of weeks to to to come visit me.

1109
00:54:00,896 --> 00:54:07,180
~ the you have to take the step to

1110
00:54:07,180 --> 00:54:08,780
be able to ex to to care.

1111
00:54:09,900 --> 00:54:10,900
Yeah.

1112
00:54:10,301 --> 00:54:11,432
And then it's the best thing in the world.

1113
00:54:12,352 --> 00:54:17,215
So when this book comes out, what's the
intention behind writing it?

1114
00:54:17,215 --> 00:54:20,156
What do you hope that the average person
who doesn't know Matt,

1115
00:54:20,156 --> 00:54:24,859
who just sees it either on Amazon or they
listen to it on Audible,

1116
00:54:24,859 --> 00:54:26,000
I'm assuming it's going to be there.

1117
00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:29,903
and or someone says, Hey, you should read
this book,

1118
00:54:29,903 --> 00:54:35,146
what's the intention behind you hope is
left with that person every time it's
read?

1119
00:54:36,024 --> 00:54:38,065
So I'll say the first thing is you can
check it out now.

1120
00:54:38,065 --> 00:54:41,728
It's an anendless future.com. you could
you can download the PDF,

1121
00:54:41,728 --> 00:54:44,340
dump it in an LLM, and ask it any
questions you want.

1122
00:54:44,340 --> 00:54:48,022
I've got it so you can hit click play and
and and it'll it'll you can listen to it.

1123
00:54:48,022 --> 00:54:55,007
the the I I think there are two two goals
I have for it.

1124
00:54:55,007 --> 00:55:00,711
the first is I don't think that society
fully recognizes

1125
00:55:01,071 --> 00:55:05,204
how much control we have over our future
and what

1126
00:55:05,516 --> 00:55:09,498
The lever is certainly one of them that we
have to kind of press.

1127
00:55:09,498 --> 00:55:11,740
I use the meta metaphor of like the
acupuncture point.

1128
00:55:11,740 --> 00:55:14,452
Like I got back pain up here from a
climbing accident.

1129
00:55:14,452 --> 00:55:17,504
And it wasn't, and I tried yoga and all
the things and I had back pain

1130
00:55:17,504 --> 00:55:20,486
and just wouldn't go away. And it wasn't
until one day I'm on my foam roller

1131
00:55:20,486 --> 00:55:24,318
and I feel under my armpit rather than
around my back this tight muscle.

1132
00:55:24,318 --> 00:55:26,319
And I got acupuncture there. I was like,

1133
00:55:26,319 --> 00:55:29,741
that's the spot. And all of a sudden I
could hold my hands even again

1134
00:55:29,741 --> 00:55:30,741
and the back pain went away.

1135
00:55:31,820 --> 00:55:33,521
And that doesn't mean that's the entirety
of health.

1136
00:55:33,521 --> 00:55:36,524
I still have to take care of all my health
and go do yoga and running

1137
00:55:36,524 --> 00:55:41,419
and all the things. But I couldn't have
felt better if I hadn't released that

1138
00:55:41,419 --> 00:55:45,062
muscle. And in a complex system,

1139
00:55:45,062 --> 00:55:47,675
like a body or like the world or a
country,

1140
00:55:47,675 --> 00:55:52,479
we need to identify what is the one spot
that we have to put the needle and then
go,

1141
00:55:52,479 --> 00:55:53,631
maybe there are a couple of them,

1142
00:55:53,631 --> 00:55:55,933
but we certainly have to try to identify
what they are.

1143
00:55:55,933 --> 00:55:57,114
And

1144
00:55:58,034 --> 00:56:01,605
In a world where I I I I actually use in
in the kickoff in the book,

1145
00:56:01,605 --> 00:56:02,675
I talk about these two globes.

1146
00:56:02,675 --> 00:56:05,526
And I'm literally looking at the bright
globe here and the dark globe over

1147
00:56:05,526 --> 00:56:08,177
in the corner there. And like which
humanity are we gonna have,

1148
00:56:08,177 --> 00:56:09,777
a bright world or a dark world?

1149
00:56:09,777 --> 00:56:12,458
What is going to determine the answer to
that?

1150
00:56:12,458 --> 00:56:16,289
And from my perspective, it is really,

1151
00:56:16,289 --> 00:56:20,900
really clear that until we have the next
generation capable of

1152
00:56:21,540 --> 00:56:27,122
~ having jobs at at a at a baseline and
solving all of the other problems.

1153
00:56:27,734 --> 00:56:32,699
We won't have we could end up in a really
dark world.

1154
00:56:32,699 --> 00:56:37,354
And and I I'll I'll say there's a great
book that I spent actually a

1155
00:56:37,354 --> 00:56:39,947
lot of time talking about in the book
called The Fourth Turning.

1156
00:56:39,947 --> 00:56:42,870
and it talks about the cyclicality,

1157
00:56:42,870 --> 00:56:46,564
the cycles of of of the world and how
there's this hundred-year,

1158
00:56:46,564 --> 00:56:48,717
eighty to a hundred year seculum cycle.

1159
00:56:48,717 --> 00:56:49,717
~

1160
00:56:50,538 --> 00:56:52,429
Of good times and bad times, basically,

1161
00:56:52,429 --> 00:56:56,450
or crisis and awakening, which is kind of
an internal reordering of society,

1162
00:56:56,450 --> 00:56:57,960
like the hippie kind of movement of,

1163
00:56:57,960 --> 00:57:02,952
you know, the 60s and 70s. And if you look
at where we are today,

1164
00:57:02,952 --> 00:57:05,042
which is 80 years post-World War II,

1165
00:57:05,042 --> 00:57:07,363
almost to the, to the, to the to the month
practically,

1166
00:57:07,363 --> 00:57:10,884
it is it it's right on schedule.

1167
00:57:10,884 --> 00:57:15,305
And they wrote the fourth turning in the
late 90s when everything was good.

1168
00:57:15,305 --> 00:57:18,796
And they're like, there's gonna be a
crisis coming in the mid-2000s.

1169
00:57:19,486 --> 00:57:23,428
And so you know, they wrote it ~ in in the
prior quarter.

1170
00:57:23,428 --> 00:57:29,692
And so it it is ~ terrifying to be on the
precipice of a crisis.

1171
00:57:29,692 --> 00:57:35,245
And ~ and yet there's probably going to be
a crisis.

1172
00:57:35,245 --> 00:57:39,157
There's probably going to be something
harder tomorrow than there is today.

1173
00:57:39,157 --> 00:57:41,608
And there were many things that it could
be.

1174
00:57:41,608 --> 00:57:43,809
It could be AI taking jobs, it could be
war with China,

1175
00:57:43,809 --> 00:57:45,160
it could be the global debt crisis,

1176
00:57:45,160 --> 00:57:47,011
it could be many things, the next
pandemic,

1177
00:57:47,011 --> 00:57:48,842
who knows what it is. But

1178
00:57:49,886 --> 00:57:52,548
~ the interesting thing about the fourth
turning,

1179
00:57:52,548 --> 00:57:54,600
if if you believe that cyclicality,

1180
00:57:54,600 --> 00:57:55,611
and you know when you read the book,

1181
00:57:55,611 --> 00:57:57,012
it's just a very, very compelling case.

1182
00:57:57,012 --> 00:57:58,012
You just see it. I mean, literally,

1183
00:57:57,922 --> 00:57:59,665
it's you the the the Romans talked about
it,

1184
00:57:59,665 --> 00:58:02,177
you know, ~ do they found the same cycle?

1185
00:58:02,177 --> 00:58:05,959
They there's a first turning always after
the fourth turning.

1186
00:58:05,959 --> 00:58:08,482
In other words, the crisis happens,

1187
00:58:08,482 --> 00:58:10,824
there's a restructuring of society.

1188
00:58:10,824 --> 00:58:14,047
It's kind of like it all burns down and
then new things grow back.

1189
00:58:14,047 --> 00:58:17,100
And what grows back is

1190
00:58:17,336 --> 00:58:20,969
probably more important than what the
crisis looks like because it's what

1191
00:58:20,969 --> 00:58:24,431
you are left with. And what grows back,

1192
00:58:24,431 --> 00:58:28,974
I believe, is going to be decided by
whether humans can have jobs,

1193
00:58:28,974 --> 00:58:31,721
whether there's, you know, elites that
have,

1194
00:58:31,721 --> 00:58:34,859
you know, they're trillionaires and the
rest have nothing.

1195
00:58:34,859 --> 00:58:36,180
You know, the mother who describes,

1196
00:58:36,180 --> 00:58:39,972
I used to be able to feed my ch child
olive oil and now I'm feeding them Crisco

1197
00:58:39,972 --> 00:58:41,924
because I can't afford olive oil anymore.

1198
00:58:41,924 --> 00:58:44,105
Like that is a reason for anger.

1199
00:58:44,105 --> 00:58:45,105
And there are a lot of

1200
00:58:45,354 --> 00:58:47,575
Angry people that if they won't have a
job,

1201
00:58:47,575 --> 00:58:51,896
they won't be happy. The re French
Revolution happened at 20% unemployment.

1202
00:58:51,896 --> 00:58:55,297
Imagine what will happen in a world of AI
where it's taken away all the jobs.

1203
00:58:55,702 --> 00:58:56,702
Yeah.

1204
00:58:56,477 --> 00:59:01,248
So I believe we have to. Like how how the
alternative is like the way

1205
00:59:01,248 --> 00:59:06,440
of framing is how can we possibly have a
good outcome if no one has

1206
00:59:06,440 --> 00:59:08,680
the skills to have a a good job?

1207
00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:13,532
And yet we live in a world where now the d
default consensus is I'm better

1208
00:59:13,532 --> 00:59:14,732
off not going to college.

1209
00:59:16,566 --> 00:59:20,400
More people, more high schoolers don't
want to go to college than do want

1210
00:59:20,400 --> 00:59:23,052
to go to college. The first time in
American history that that's happened,

1211
00:59:23,052 --> 00:59:25,875
or in recent history. ~ you know,

1212
00:59:25,875 --> 00:59:29,198
since basically college it you know stood
as a strong institution.

1213
00:59:29,198 --> 00:59:32,991
And and yet it's the number one pathway
up.

1214
00:59:32,991 --> 00:59:36,625
I'm not saying you have to go there in
many cases of people who have been very

1215
00:59:36,625 --> 00:59:39,668
successful without it, but it's the number
one pathway up.

1216
00:59:39,668 --> 00:59:42,090
And it's broken.

1217
00:59:42,862 --> 00:59:43,978
So, if we believe

1218
00:59:46,242 --> 00:59:48,755
that an argument that maybe we're in the
fourth turning.

1219
00:59:52,812 --> 00:59:56,130
What do you do? What does the individual
do?

1220
00:59:57,646 --> 01:00:01,669
So the first is is shore up. Save up,

1221
01:00:01,669 --> 01:00:04,911
make sure you're safe, like individually,

1222
01:00:04,911 --> 01:00:08,734
make sure you are doing whatever you need
so that under any circumstance,

1223
01:00:08,734 --> 01:00:10,565
like I will use the word financially,

1224
01:00:10,565 --> 01:00:12,561
you're okay. There are many other forms of
okay.

1225
01:00:12,561 --> 01:00:16,200
I mean safety, you're okay, but but that
like you are secure.

1226
01:00:16,200 --> 01:00:21,784
And caution, ~ i in an era of greed,

1227
01:00:21,784 --> 01:00:23,805
greed and fear, right? They way we were
back and forth.

1228
01:00:23,805 --> 01:00:24,906
We live in in right now a

1229
01:00:25,090 --> 01:00:27,131
Booming, wow, I I you I'm missing the
wave,

1230
01:00:27,131 --> 01:00:29,353
or I could be on the wave, or if only I
ride the way,

1231
01:00:29,353 --> 01:00:30,654
ride the wave a little bit longer.

1232
01:00:30,654 --> 01:00:32,945
And I'm not going to give market investing
advice that,

1233
01:00:32,945 --> 01:00:34,833
you know, because I'm far from qualified
to do it,

1234
01:00:34,833 --> 01:00:36,978
it's not what I do. but I'll say,

1235
01:00:36,978 --> 01:00:38,259
do whatever it takes to be safe.

1236
01:00:38,259 --> 01:00:42,812
The second is beyond that,

1237
01:00:42,812 --> 01:00:46,705
~ I think there are powers that be that
will determine it

1238
01:00:46,725 --> 01:00:49,537
way beyond any individual's power to to
change it.

1239
01:00:49,537 --> 01:00:51,518
In other words, who knows what Trump does,

1240
01:00:51,518 --> 01:00:53,890
who knows what she does, who knows what
Iran does.

1241
01:00:54,274 --> 01:00:56,185
Like it it ain't up to us, right?

1242
01:00:56,185 --> 01:00:59,076
It it's we're gonna we're gonna ride the
wave other people create.

1243
01:00:59,076 --> 01:01:03,376
and what I would say though is,

1244
01:01:03,376 --> 01:01:05,719
you know, and I and I write this in the
book,

1245
01:01:05,719 --> 01:01:08,160
that the fourth turning is kind of
destiny,

1246
01:01:08,160 --> 01:01:11,161
but what happens in the first turning is
not.

1247
01:01:11,161 --> 01:01:15,964
In other words, like if a school district
or a state

1248
01:01:16,384 --> 01:01:21,386
or a parent trains their children to be
thriving in the first turning.

1249
01:01:21,560 --> 01:01:23,372
When they grow up t five years from now,

1250
01:01:23,372 --> 01:01:25,334
ten years from now, fifteen years from
now,

1251
01:01:25,334 --> 01:01:27,936
like that that individual

1252
01:01:28,075 --> 01:01:29,075
Or that's

1253
01:01:28,737 --> 01:01:33,442
school system of individuals will be
prepared to thrive.

1254
01:01:33,942 --> 01:01:37,018
Mm. Isn't that how life goes? The things
that we're earning and

1255
01:01:37,018 --> 01:01:38,670
the life we're living in this decade,

1256
01:01:38,670 --> 01:01:40,554
it was developed in the decade prior.

1257
01:01:41,487 --> 01:01:43,141
In everything, in our physical health,

1258
01:01:43,141 --> 01:01:45,446
in our mental health, in our lives and
relationships,

1259
01:01:45,446 --> 01:01:46,446
everything.

1260
01:01:46,378 --> 01:01:48,009
I haven't seen many things. I mean,

1261
01:01:48,009 --> 01:01:50,140
there's tragedies that happen that fast,

1262
01:01:50,140 --> 01:01:52,621
but other the things that we're in control
of,

1263
01:01:52,621 --> 01:01:55,163
which I do believe is the vast majority of
our lives,

1264
01:01:55,163 --> 01:02:00,145
you know, what I'm not gonna we all have
loved ones that tragic things happen to.

1265
01:02:00,145 --> 01:02:02,937
I could go out here tomorrow and I'm going
through a green light

1266
01:02:02,937 --> 01:02:05,133
and someone else makes a mistake and comes
through the light and then

1267
01:02:05,133 --> 01:02:07,469
my life's over. Those are things that
aren't in our control.

1268
01:02:07,469 --> 01:02:09,550
But there's so many things that are.

1269
01:02:09,550 --> 01:02:14,753
And if we would just focus on turning
ourselves into another higher level

1270
01:02:14,753 --> 01:02:15,934
of capable human beings.

1271
01:02:16,450 --> 01:02:19,355
Go to elite in as many categories as you
possibly can.

1272
01:02:19,355 --> 01:02:23,041
Don't compare yourself to somebody else on
on Instagram or what celebrities

1273
01:02:23,041 --> 01:02:26,026
are doing. Turn yourself yourself into a
better form today.

1274
01:02:26,026 --> 01:02:28,610
And I think if we wake up every day and we
put our head down and

1275
01:02:28,610 --> 01:02:30,954
we do that consciously, you're probably
gonna be ready.

1276
01:02:32,990 --> 01:02:35,492
That's right. That's that's exactly right.

1277
01:02:35,492 --> 01:02:40,096
If you can make sh you have to survive the
fourth turning and then you have

1278
01:02:40,096 --> 01:02:42,218
to build the skills to be strong for the
first turning.

1279
01:02:42,902 --> 01:02:45,104
And and accept that in these moments it's
gonna be hard.

1280
01:02:45,104 --> 01:02:48,356
Because in some of my greatest moments in
life,

1281
01:02:48,356 --> 01:02:49,987
and some of the biggest accomplishments,

1282
01:02:49,987 --> 01:02:52,209
there's still hard moments. It's called
life.

1283
01:02:52,209 --> 01:02:55,251
It's all around us, right? And the things
that I love,

1284
01:02:55,251 --> 01:02:57,372
the people I love, there's still hard
things every day.

1285
01:02:57,372 --> 01:03:01,575
And accepting that part of it that I have
responsibility in to still take actions

1286
01:03:01,635 --> 01:03:04,017
to determine my outcome as much as I can,

1287
01:03:04,017 --> 01:03:05,398
it makes it a lot more simple.

1288
01:03:07,128 --> 01:03:10,501
The the fourth turning talks about the the
this it has seasons,

1289
01:03:10,501 --> 01:03:12,653
right? So the the the high you know,

1290
01:03:12,653 --> 01:03:15,765
~ spring and then you have the summer and
then you have the fall and

1291
01:03:15,765 --> 01:03:17,982
and then the winter is the fourth turning.

1292
01:03:17,982 --> 01:03:19,599
You know, it it it it it's funny actually,

1293
01:03:19,599 --> 01:03:23,572
the the the book The Game of Thrones was
written within months of

1294
01:03:23,572 --> 01:03:26,594
of the fourth turning publishing and they
both talk about winter is coming.

1295
01:03:26,594 --> 01:03:30,017
And you know, i it winter's hard,

1296
01:03:30,017 --> 01:03:31,779
winter's cold, winter's, you know,

1297
01:03:31,779 --> 01:03:35,412
sometimes brutal. ~ but it's a it's a
season.

1298
01:03:36,226 --> 01:03:39,528
And when you know that it's a season and
that spring comes afterwards,

1299
01:03:39,528 --> 01:03:42,089
it's a a lot easier to endure it.

1300
01:03:42,089 --> 01:03:43,810
It's a lot easier to prepare for it.

1301
01:03:43,810 --> 01:03:45,871
When when things are good in the fall,

1302
01:03:45,871 --> 01:03:48,733
you know, you harvest because you know the
winter is coming.

1303
01:03:48,733 --> 01:03:54,076
And so being aligned with the seasons
historically has always been important

1304
01:03:54,076 --> 01:03:56,177
for our survival. Those who didn't didn't.

1305
01:03:56,177 --> 01:04:01,420
~ and so, you know, I I think that just
thinking of this as seasons

1306
01:04:01,420 --> 01:04:04,992
of history is actually a very powerful way
of of preparing and being ready.

1307
01:04:05,848 --> 01:04:09,230
So be positive. Don't get down in the
negative places from listening

1308
01:04:09,230 --> 01:04:12,172
to Matt today saying we're in winter and
be scared.

1309
01:04:12,172 --> 01:04:16,984
And but but the reality is that ~ we can
talk about this in history

1310
01:04:16,984 --> 01:04:18,705
and as societies and as the world,

1311
01:04:18,705 --> 01:04:22,247
but we all live in different seasons than
our lives where you're at too.

1312
01:04:22,247 --> 01:04:26,550
And so we can we can win this battle based
upon our individual lives,

1313
01:04:26,550 --> 01:04:29,652
our companies, our families, and realizing
inside those,

1314
01:04:29,652 --> 01:04:31,773
there's seasons happening out here in the
greater world too,

1315
01:04:31,773 --> 01:04:33,204
and you have to have your eyes on all of
it.

1316
01:04:34,594 --> 01:04:37,016
Yeah, I mean you you you mentioned ~ you
know death.

1317
01:04:37,016 --> 01:04:40,458
My my my brother was a huge longevity guy.

1318
01:04:40,458 --> 01:04:42,100
It's just kind of, you know, h his thing.

1319
01:04:42,100 --> 01:04:47,444
~ and ironically he died at the age I
currently am in a in a car accident

1320
01:04:47,444 --> 01:04:49,065
and just kind of driving home one day.

1321
01:04:49,065 --> 01:04:54,409
And you know, I i i and and wow that
rocked my world,

1322
01:04:54,409 --> 01:05:01,134
and and his little daughter's world and
and ~ as you say

1323
01:05:01,390 --> 01:05:04,572
we we you go through hard things and then
you take them forward and

1324
01:05:04,572 --> 01:05:05,823
you know you internalize them.

1325
01:05:05,823 --> 01:05:09,816
I've internalized my brother and you know
live with him as part of my life

1326
01:05:10,957 --> 01:05:14,460
and with his little girl I saw last
weekend.

1327
01:05:14,460 --> 01:05:20,324
and you know so I I I life can be hard.

1328
01:05:20,324 --> 01:05:23,586
~ and in the grief, as that example,

1329
01:05:23,586 --> 01:05:26,869
like people laugh again, people smile
again,

1330
01:05:26,869 --> 01:05:28,310
people come out of it again.

1331
01:05:29,132 --> 01:05:33,825
Yeah. Hundred percent. ~ and you'll smile
a lot today.

1332
01:05:33,825 --> 01:05:35,315
You'll find things when you're off of
here,

1333
01:05:35,315 --> 01:05:38,047
right, right there. Right. Even thinking
about the idea of smiling

1334
01:05:38,047 --> 01:05:39,208
and spending time with your kids.

1335
01:05:39,208 --> 01:05:41,949
And you talked about you're back in
Connecticut in the in the family home

1336
01:05:41,949 --> 01:05:44,330
and spending time with the kids that you
knew since school.

1337
01:05:44,330 --> 01:05:47,032
Like it's ~ in the hardest moments I've
found,

1338
01:05:47,032 --> 01:05:49,753
if we can just get through and try to just
fight and just be

1339
01:05:49,753 --> 01:05:51,194
so determined and realize, like,

1340
01:05:51,194 --> 01:05:54,256
hey, let me figure out the best way
through this bad scenario.

1341
01:05:54,256 --> 01:05:57,808
And I think what we've all taught
ourselves that kept going is like it's
gonna

1342
01:05:57,808 --> 01:05:58,808
get better again.

1343
01:05:58,924 --> 01:06:02,697
It just is. And if I think if we have that
optimistic nature about this country,

1344
01:06:02,697 --> 01:06:04,619
about what's possible, if we do believe,

1345
01:06:04,619 --> 01:06:08,442
hey, like it can get better. Like we can
do this thing even in the midst of hard,

1346
01:06:08,442 --> 01:06:10,213
really difficult times, like, all right,

1347
01:06:10,213 --> 01:06:11,714
let me take care of my responsibility,

1348
01:06:11,714 --> 01:06:13,916
get to work, get involved in the
communities,

1349
01:06:13,916 --> 01:06:16,308
build these relationships, and go out here
and make a little difference

1350
01:06:16,468 --> 01:06:18,520
if it's to your point just picking up a
piece of trash,

1351
01:06:18,520 --> 01:06:21,372
because when I do that walking into one of
my buildings,

1352
01:06:21,372 --> 01:06:23,554
I still pick up pieces of trash.

1353
01:06:23,554 --> 01:06:26,937
And there's there's people that it's their
job to do it.

1354
01:06:26,937 --> 01:06:28,598
But it's my job too.

1355
01:06:29,516 --> 01:06:33,955
And every time that I see myself doing
something so basic and so small,

1356
01:06:33,955 --> 01:06:37,132
it's worthwhile and I feel like it's
making a little bit of a difference.

1357
01:06:38,614 --> 01:06:42,215
The the the one place I'd push back a
little a bit,

1358
01:06:42,215 --> 01:06:44,296
but it but it's actually you asked why I
wrote the book,

1359
01:06:44,296 --> 01:06:50,397
is because I I I don't think it's optimism
alone that's gonna get us there.

1360
01:06:50,397 --> 01:06:52,818
I I I think there is this thing.

1361
01:06:52,818 --> 01:06:55,639
We have to train the next generation to
thrive.

1362
01:06:55,639 --> 01:06:58,399
Like o optimism, but they don't have the
skills.

1363
01:06:58,399 --> 01:07:03,331
Good luck. You know, you could be
pessimistic and they grow up with

1364
01:07:03,331 --> 01:07:05,011
the skills and they will come out,

1365
01:07:05,011 --> 01:07:07,074
you know, hardy and, you know,

1366
01:07:07,074 --> 01:07:08,074
capable.

1367
01:07:08,046 --> 01:07:09,046
I

1368
01:07:08,096 --> 01:07:09,096
like

1369
01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:09,280
I live.

1370
01:07:09,058 --> 01:07:11,053
and I like it. I'm like, what's my brain
do with that?

1371
01:07:11,053 --> 01:07:12,838
Here's what my brain does is that I said,

1372
01:07:12,838 --> 01:07:14,461
okay, Matt pushes back on that.

1373
01:07:14,461 --> 01:07:17,950
But it's so easier to take action and
believe when I'm optimistic.

1374
01:07:19,328 --> 01:07:22,384
I I totally agree with that. I totally
agree with that.

1375
01:07:22,384 --> 01:07:23,384
It it

1376
01:07:23,052 --> 01:07:24,052
Optimism

1377
01:07:23,484 --> 01:07:26,014
alone, I agree with you, but there has to
be action combined with it.

1378
01:07:26,626 --> 01:07:27,967
That's right. It it was interesting.

1379
01:07:27,967 --> 01:07:31,589
~ you know, I talk about hard things in
the book,

1380
01:07:31,589 --> 01:07:34,660
but but we just had the company retreat
and we had a government kind

1381
01:07:34,660 --> 01:07:37,773
of giving feedback on the book so that I
could incorporate it and and and

1382
01:07:37,773 --> 01:07:40,314
one of the things I heard a bunch of times
is actually how optimistic it was.

1383
01:07:40,314 --> 01:07:44,396
Because it I when you know what can drive
a better f future,

1384
01:07:44,396 --> 01:07:46,898
then you can be optimistic because you
know what you can do about it.

1385
01:07:48,898 --> 01:07:50,819
So good. I could sit and talk to you
forever,

1386
01:07:50,819 --> 01:07:53,060
man. ~ it's awesome to to listen to you.

1387
01:07:53,060 --> 01:07:56,281
But at some point we got to wrap this up
because you have kids to spend time with

1388
01:07:56,281 --> 01:07:59,203
and smile and you have companies to build
and you've added another chapter

1389
01:07:59,203 --> 01:08:03,245
to the book. But I I appreciate you
spending this time and ~ just somebody
that's

1390
01:08:03,245 --> 01:08:05,526
developed your brain with your experiences
around the world,

1391
01:08:05,526 --> 01:08:09,248
you have a complete understanding about
what you're gonna do with Endless.

1392
01:08:09,248 --> 01:08:11,619
I I have a feeling. I don't know what it's
gonna become because I'm

1393
01:08:11,619 --> 01:08:13,790
not the one sitting there on a board or
involved in it,

1394
01:08:13,790 --> 01:08:14,790
but

1395
01:08:14,486 --> 01:08:16,197
I think it's gonna make a big a difference
out here.

1396
01:08:16,197 --> 01:08:18,787
I really do. And when I walk away from
this conversation,

1397
01:08:18,787 --> 01:08:21,008
it'll get my brain turning a little bit
more about like,

1398
01:08:21,008 --> 01:08:22,618
hey, let's us re engage a little bit more.

1399
01:08:22,618 --> 01:08:24,529
Like let's look for these areas to make a
difference.

1400
01:08:24,529 --> 01:08:28,270
Even if we don't have all Matt's time now
to put this complete linear focus on that,

1401
01:08:28,270 --> 01:08:30,201
like let's go out here and do our part a
little bit more.

1402
01:08:30,201 --> 01:08:31,991
And I'm gonna be pumped about following
this.

1403
01:08:31,991 --> 01:08:33,769
So ~ what do you want us to know?

1404
01:08:33,769 --> 01:08:37,533
W w as as anybody still listening at the
end of this and as we put

1405
01:08:37,533 --> 01:08:40,634
out reels and YouTube shorts, ~

1406
01:08:41,761 --> 01:08:43,671
When you woke up today, what'd you what'd
you want us to know?

1407
01:08:43,671 --> 01:08:45,178
Us, the world, the people you talk to?

1408
01:08:45,178 --> 01:08:46,826
What do you what do you want us to know
the rest of the day?

1409
01:08:48,044 --> 01:08:52,045
I I I think the the the cycles,

1410
01:08:52,045 --> 01:08:54,446
the the world can go through a tough time.

1411
01:08:54,446 --> 01:08:57,216
We may be in a fourth turning of of of
crisis.

1412
01:08:57,216 --> 01:08:59,397
There is a first turning afterwards.

1413
01:08:59,397 --> 01:09:01,617
There always has been, there there always
will be.

1414
01:09:01,617 --> 01:09:03,808
The nature of that first turning,

1415
01:09:03,808 --> 01:09:07,979
the nature of w what it looks like when
the world is,

1416
01:09:07,979 --> 01:09:11,640
you know, kind of reformatted and
reconfigured and is rebuilt,

1417
01:09:11,640 --> 01:09:16,441
~ I believe will be determined by one
really important variable,

1418
01:09:16,441 --> 01:09:17,441
which is

1419
01:09:17,057 --> 01:09:20,859
Do young people have the ability to have
jobs in that world?

1420
01:09:20,859 --> 01:09:24,662
And if they do, they'll go build amazing
things.

1421
01:09:24,662 --> 01:09:27,662
If they don't, then we have no reason for
optimism.

1422
01:09:27,662 --> 01:09:30,705
So it it it is it it is,

1423
01:09:30,705 --> 01:09:35,868
I believe, the defining variable of
whether or not we should be optimistic
about

1424
01:09:35,868 --> 01:09:37,569
the future. And if we can go do it,

1425
01:09:37,569 --> 01:09:38,569
then we can be.

1426
01:09:39,758 --> 01:09:41,956
All right, man. Thanks for bringing the
message to us today.

1427
01:09:41,956 --> 01:09:44,758
Much appreciated. We're better off for
taking this hour.

1428
01:09:45,399 --> 01:09:48,142
Thank you. And and read more at an endless
future dot com and give

1429
01:09:48,142 --> 01:09:50,462
me feedback 'cause that's why it's out
there and you know,

1430
01:09:50,462 --> 01:09:52,926
comment and and I got my email on there
and anyway.

1431
01:09:52,926 --> 01:09:53,926
So so please

1432
01:09:54,572 --> 01:09:55,572
Tell

1433
01:09:54,742 --> 01:09:56,874
him what tell him what extra chapters he's
missing.

1434
01:09:57,378 --> 01:09:59,298
Yes. Or or which chapters to delete.

1435
01:09:59,298 --> 01:10:00,298
Disagree with me.

1436
01:10:00,760 --> 01:10:01,760
Thank you.